00:00:00 --- log: started forth/03.11.14 01:28:31 --- join: schihei (~schihei@blueice1a.de.ibm.com) joined #forth 02:56:54 --- join: haroldo (~haroldo@r200-40-213-224.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) joined #forth 03:08:59 --- quit: haroldo_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03:19:01 --- join: warp0x00 (~warpzero@dsl.31.mt.onewest.net) joined #forth 03:24:11 ... 03:26:45 sup guys 03:26:57 hm nothing 03:27:29 somehow it's difficult for me to juggle values on the stack, keeping track where what is 03:27:33 it complicates matters 03:28:45 sometimes i need up to 5 or 6 values on the stack. but it's said you shouldnt have more than 3. so how is it possible without using variables? 03:47:06 --- quit: SDO ("Vision[0.9.6-0203]: i've been blurred!") 03:56:12 --- join: Zoopee (alsbergt@zoopee.org) joined #forth 04:11:33 can anyone tell me about a website where i can see different examples of forth code 04:11:39 just some easy programmes 04:29:05 --- join: Serg_Penguin (~z@212.34.52.140) joined #forth 04:37:03 --- quit: Serg_Penguin () 06:25:35 --- join: tathi (~josh@pcp02123722pcs.milfrd01.pa.comcast.net) joined #forth 06:26:46 moritz_: there's nothing wrong with variables... 06:28:21 --- quit: warp0x00 ("#") 06:33:04 oh ic. i just read some tutorials which stated that variables are to be avoided 06:33:36 well, you don't want to overdo it. 06:34:08 But I've seen something where someone asked chuck the same question, and he basically said 06:34:20 don't strain yourself. if you need a variable, use it. 06:35:37 ic 06:35:39 thanks 06:36:16 that said, 5-6 values sounds like a lot. 06:36:54 it takes practice, but I've found that you usually _can_ factor things so you're not dealing with more than 3 things at a time. 06:36:58 and usually 2. 06:38:04 was there something in particular that you were having trouble with? 06:39:39 i'm having two references to strings, two characters and one number on the stack 06:46:18 ah. yeah, string compares and stuff like that are tricky. 06:47:30 machineForth (I think?) has an A register that gives you another place to keep an address, which is really nice. 06:49:11 what are you using forth for? 06:49:35 well... 06:49:43 actually, nothing lately. 06:50:00 I _was_ working on a colorforth OS for a while 06:50:42 isn't colorforth already a little os? 06:50:52 well yeah. 06:50:57 I was doing a PPC version 06:51:04 i see 06:51:20 what would have been the use of it for you? 06:51:30 just to have colorforth 06:51:30 ? 06:51:40 something that I could use instead of linux 06:51:55 a whole os? 06:52:04 yah 06:52:05 i mean you wanted to replace it completely? 06:52:15 well, just for my personal use. 06:52:25 yah 06:52:42 e-mail, irc, some web browsing, programming. 06:53:01 why did you get stuck? 06:53:43 I didn't, really. I just seem to be more interested in experimenting with stuff than actually making something usable. 06:53:46 :) 06:53:56 heh 06:54:41 and partly, PPC doesn't make the greatest stack machine. 06:54:41 i really don't know what to experiment with after having finished this fscking string compare word 06:54:46 :) 06:55:20 yeah, that's why I like writing my own forths. You have to write everything. 06:55:21 everything interesting is too complicated 06:55:33 what do you write it in? 06:55:42 assembly language, generally. 06:55:47 I wrote a couple in C. 06:56:03 (ugh) 06:56:08 and one in Forth, of course. :) 06:56:16 i don't know how to write c. maybe i'll try to write one in perl. just because i can. :) 06:56:31 heh. You can write forth in _anything_. 06:56:35 i meant to say: i dont know how to write assembler 06:56:52 Speuler wrote one that's a bash script. 06:57:02 there's also one in python 06:57:05 and one in tcl 06:57:24 yup 06:57:32 --- quit: skylan (Success) 06:57:51 why is everyone idling so extensively? nothing to discuss? 06:58:10 oh, quite possibly :) 06:58:31 what forth are you using on linux? 06:58:40 which even 06:58:57 I think just one of mine at the moment. 06:59:13 I know I don't have gforth installed. 06:59:44 why not? anti-anser? 06:59:54 Partly... 07:00:24 And Gentoo wanted to install emacs before it installed gforth 07:00:52 and I didn't feel like fixing it. 07:01:02 huh, my gentoo let me install gforth w/o emacs 07:01:18 yeah, it just wanted it because there's an emacs mode. 07:01:56 That was a while ago, may have been an early ebuild. 07:02:16 Yeah, it's not doing it now. 07:04:45 Another thing (idling) is that a bunch of the people have been regulars for a while...already know other people's opinions on most things forthy. 07:05:09 But you never know when an interesting conversation may break out ;) 07:06:35 like yesterday about GUI's 07:07:11 yup 07:08:39 well, gotta run... 07:08:43 --- quit: tathi (""laters"") 07:37:49 --- join: TreyB (~trey@cpe-66-87-192-27.tx.sprintbbd.net) joined #forth 08:21:16 --- quit: schihei (Client Quit) 08:32:24 --- join: I440r (~mark4@saturn.vcsd.com) joined #forth 08:48:22 --- quit: I440r (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 08:48:23 --- quit: Zoopee (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 08:48:32 --- join: I440r (~mark4@saturn.vcsd.com) joined #forth 08:49:16 --- join: Zoopee (alsbergt@zoopee.org) joined #forth 08:51:16 --- join: Herkamire (~jason@h000094d30ba2.ne.client2.attbi.com) joined #forth 08:54:46 --- quit: I440r (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 08:55:03 --- join: I440r (~mark4@saturn.vcsd.com) joined #forth 09:12:23 --- join: Serg_Penguin (~z@212.34.52.140) joined #forth 09:19:08 serg! 09:19:14 <-- at work - 09:19:18 hi ! 09:51:17 --- quit: Serg_Penguin () 10:10:26 --- join: warp0x00 (~warpzero@dsl.31.mt.onewest.net) joined #forth 10:23:31 --- join: madgarden (~bughead@216.94.153.178) joined #forth 12:59:22 --- join: ASau (~asau@158.250.48.197) joined #forth 12:59:34 Dobryjj vecher! 12:59:59 privet alekesj 13:00:11 Privet, mur! 13:03:37 errr... someone has got 1,2 billion points in nethack 13:03:38 :D 13:04:20 --- join: jstahuman (dan@pcp053338pcs.brlngt01.nj.comcast.net) joined #forth 13:07:06 Privet, ASau 13:07:11 Terve, mur 13:07:18 And hi, human. 13:07:24 privet robert 13:07:31 :) 13:19:52 * mur no human 13:19:53 >:) 13:20:10 ASau: you were the nethacker? 13:36:20 --- quit: ASau (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13:36:47 --- join: wossname (wossname@HSE-Sherbrooke-ppp79751.qc.sympatico.ca) joined #forth 13:42:55 Hey woss 13:45:35 hi robert 14:52:09 --- join: gilbertdeb (~gilbert@fl-nked-ubr2-c3a-37.miamfl.adelphia.net) joined #forth 14:52:17 --- part: madgarden left #forth 14:52:21 aloha 14:52:45 moi 14:53:40 terve mur 14:58:04 --- join: haroldo_ (~haroldo@r200-40-167-138.adsl.anteldata.net.uy) joined #forth 14:58:48 --- quit: I440r ("bbl") 14:59:53 --- quit: wossname ("durrr plvxc,.b") 15:10:27 --- quit: haroldo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15:13:37 --- join: jamc (dne@as3-6-8.asp.s.bonet.se) joined #forth 15:44:50 --- quit: arke (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 15:44:59 --- part: gilbertdeb left #forth 15:59:13 --- join: Sonarman (~matt@adsl-67-113-234-208.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 16:17:12 --- quit: moritz_ ("Leaving") 16:26:29 --- join: ASau (~asau@158.250.48.197) joined #forth 16:26:48 Dobryjj nocher! 16:30:56 --- join: arke (~chris@ca-cmrilo-cuda1-c3b-66.vnnyca.adelphia.net) joined #forth 16:32:37 Dobryjj nocher, arke! 16:34:51 --- quit: jamc ("I feel partially hydrogenated!") 16:36:00 greetings, ASau 16:45:58 --- quit: Sonarman ("leaving") 16:46:55 arke, so what do you think about that idea of mine? 16:47:10 ASau: er. ..which idea? lol 16:47:23 so many people always offer their ideas ... its hard to keep them all straight :) 16:48:18 Hm. Weren't that you, whom I told about plotter? 16:48:40 possibly ... you have to remind me again 16:49:55 Maybe it's better to get logs for thursday morning. 16:50:00 http://www.zorg.org/unixhumour/c.language.pranks.html 16:50:28 It's too long to remind, I think. 16:54:09 :) 16:54:14 sry 16:55:37 ? 16:59:57 --- quit: ASau ("Toffee IRC client for DOS v1.0/b535") 17:17:53 --- join: TheBlueWizard (TheBlueWiz@207.111.96.67) joined #forth 17:17:53 --- mode: ChanServ set +o TheBlueWizard 17:17:56 hiya all 17:28:23 --- quit: jstahuman ("leaving") 17:39:23 --- join: jamc (dne@as3-6-8.asp.s.bonet.se) joined #forth 17:40:02 hi TheBlueWizard :) 17:41:54 hiya Herkamire 17:45:08 :) 17:52:52 ooOOooh dinner is ready. bbl 17:53:16 * TheBlueWizard feeds arke to Herkamire ;) 17:53:30 * TheBlueWizard is known for irreverence 17:53:39 false alarm. back in the oven 17:55:59 :) 18:00:54 --- join: skylan (sjh@vickesh01-4649.tbaytel.net) joined #forth 18:01:44 hiya skylan 18:37:32 gotta go...bye all 18:37:43 --- part: TheBlueWizard left #forth 18:49:32 --- quit: jamc ("Yow! Now we can become alcoholics!") 18:56:51 :) 19:17:58 --- join: I440r (~mark4@12-178.lctv-a5.cablelynx.com) joined #forth 19:17:58 --- mode: ChanServ set +o I440r 19:28:50 --- join: kc5tja (~kc5tja@66-91-231-74.san.rr.com) joined #forth 19:28:51 --- mode: ChanServ set +o kc5tja 19:29:00 re 19:31:41 hi 19:32:17 just noticed that i compiled with -mcpu=i686 instead of -mcpu=athlon-xp lol 19:32:26 Oops. 19:32:29 recompiling 229 installed packages :/ 19:32:30 lol 19:32:36 Ouch. 19:32:36 emerge -e heh 19:32:43 emerge -e world that is 19:33:02 at least i dont have to reinstall :) 19:33:06 My car's alternator blew out today. 19:33:13 ouch 19:33:16 Yeah. :( 19:33:24 So I have to ride my bike into work tomorrow. 19:33:25 sounds like she is nickle and diming you 19:33:29 That is *SO* going to suck. 19:33:39 Nahh. 19:33:44 This is the life of a used-car driver. 19:34:11 aha heh 19:34:19 And since it's a "newer car," (86 instead of an 80), I expect things to fail more often. 19:34:27 They just don't make cars like they used to back in 79. 19:34:37 And for that matter, the cars made in 79 weren't like the ones in 69 either. 19:35:37 Anyway, I think I'm going to go murder people in Neverwinter Nights... 19:36:17 * kc5tja is away: Neverwinter Nights (chaotic evil wizard) 19:38:20 whussat ? 19:42:24 hey kc5tja 19:42:32 hey I440r 19:42:36 (or) 19:42:37 hi 19:42:42 hey Samuel, and hey Mark 19:56:14 * MysticOne growls 19:56:19 anyone here have any experience with elan systems? 19:57:24 elan ? 19:57:34 sounds familiar - tho ive not done anything with it 19:57:35 it's an embedded x86 thing ... 19:57:49 err - 386-ex ? 19:57:51 trying to get a driver compiled for a version of Linux we have running on it 19:57:53 no, 486 19:57:55 like 133 MHz 19:58:13 oh - the 386 ex was an embedded verson of the 386 19:58:23 anyway, these people are trying to compile the driver for us ... we gave them our Linux include directory, our .config, told them to use pristine 2.4.22 source 19:58:32 now they're telling us that the driver requires "porting" to our "platform" 19:58:35 which is bullshit 20:04:31 :) 20:04:47 * arke is depressed 20:05:28 that's like saying... "Oh, you're running AMD? Not Intel? We'll have to port it" 20:05:32 * MysticOne comforts arke 20:05:35 arke: why depressed? 20:06:45 well, im not originally from the US 20:07:00 and language, no matter if german or english or spanish, has always been hard for me. 20:07:35 k ... so what's the problem? 20:08:20 all this time, though, there has never been a class I could not do good in if i really tried. 20:08:26 however 20:08:44 right now, i am getting a 68% in english, and i am trying quite hard. 20:09:10 arke your english is good 20:09:16 well, yes 20:09:18 yes, very good 20:09:31 arke: would it make you feel better to find that most Americans suck at english too? :) 20:09:51 however, the current thing english teachers want you to do is analyze something, and think around 500000 fucking corners to find "the meaning" which probably isn't at all 20:09:58 poetry? 20:10:03 for example. 20:10:28 we have to analyze a story, compare it to the period, setting, figure out the theme, compare it to our own experiences. 20:10:42 and theres no one right way to do it, of course 20:10:48 sounds like English 1102 :) 20:10:56 but the teacher marks you off if you dont think "his" way 20:11:01 :( 20:11:02 yeah, that happens a lot 20:11:11 all I can say is, question him 20:11:12 which ABSOFUCKINGLUTELY RIDICULOUS 20:11:23 are you in university? 20:11:36 kc5tja: btw, did you watch The Elegant Universe on PBS? 20:11:44 the other people in the class at least are used to this thinking-too-much 20:11:53 MysticOne: high school, 11th grade. 20:11:59 ahhh... that makes it immensely more difficult 20:12:05 because nobody cares what most students think :( 20:12:08 all I can say is, question him 20:12:10 ask why yours is wrong 20:12:13 get him to explain it 20:12:34 if it's unfair, if it's an opinion question and you get poor grades because you're not giving the opinion he wants, try to get your parents involved 20:13:54 at this high school, theres not much power in the hands of the parents. 20:14:02 try :) 20:14:17 i am fortunate to have a counselor who likes me alot, and we are trying to work things out. 20:14:35 but either way, its depressing because ive never had something like this before. 20:15:11 at least, i am getting a different teacher next semester, hopefully one i can communicate with (although the teacher of my choice is not teaching that class). 20:17:36 http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/elegant/program.html <-- for anyone interested in physics and string theory 20:17:51 Nova / PBS put the entire series (3 hours) up online in Quicktime and RealVideo 20:20:46 trance makes me high 20:20:54 hehe 20:24:24 it does 20:24:30 thats why im listening to it. 20:25:56 what was the other book by leo brody? 20:26:01 not starting forth, the other one 20:26:21 oh, thinking forth, neverming 20:27:45 im trying to find a place that sells it or offers it for download or whatever. 20:43:02 man, this series is great :) 20:51:20 :) 21:03:53 i like this song. 21:16:50 --- join: PWizard (~pwizard@rdu163-111-190.nc.rr.com) joined #forth 21:17:07 hiya 21:17:15 * PWizard is a Forth n00b 21:24:27 greets 21:24:34 how are you? 21:24:53 I'm doing alright, just chilling 21:25:02 :) 21:25:06 how are you liking forth? 21:25:07 looking through the ece.cmu.edu forth tutorial 21:25:46 I think it's pretty cool. :D I'm interested in implementing an editor with it, a la EMACS in a language that doesn't suck like LISP. ;) 21:27:18 :) 21:27:44 lemme check out that tuorial.... 21:28:16 do you know of any simple text editors written in Forth? Or some example code involving large buffers that I could nick for such a purpose? 21:28:55 http://www.ece.cmu.edu/~koopman/forth/hopl.html 21:29:09 it's linked on the #forth website 21:29:44 PWizard: what forth are you using? 21:29:50 gforth 21:29:53 I'm in linux 21:30:17 * arke hasnt done alot of ANSI stuff... 21:30:23 404 :( 21:30:31 oh wait 21:30:33 nevermind 21:31:10 kc5tja: there? 21:31:33 this is more of an overview than a tutorial, actually 21:32:35 I have messed with forth a little in the past, but my only reference until lately has been "Invitation to FORTH" by Harry Katzan, Jr. pub. 1981. :) 21:36:06 --- quit: arke (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 21:36:41 --- join: arke (~chris@ca-cmrilo-cuda1-c3b-66.vnnyca.adelphia.net) joined #forth 21:36:45 re arke 21:38:00 oops :) 21:38:05 what did i miss? 21:38:29 not much, just empty space. :-/ 21:38:57 :) 21:39:01 damn CD drive 21:39:03 anyway 21:39:10 how are you faring with gforth? 21:40:15 it seems alright. I don't really understand some basic concepts (like blocks vs. files, etc) but I have written code. :) 21:40:30 oh 21:40:32 its really easy 21:40:38 I really want to implement forth on my own, but that's something I should do after I learn the language. :) 21:40:43 blocks are just chunks of memory 21:40:47 they can be a part of a file 21:40:53 they can be pretty much anything 21:40:58 heh 21:41:07 check out isforth.clss.net 21:42:36 compiling isforth now... :) 21:42:44 :) 21:42:51 its kinda awkward, but its nice 21:45:14 did you write it? 21:47:03 nope 21:47:10 I440r did 21:47:25 just now discovered that floating around the web 21:48:59 so what do you use Forth for? 21:49:07 for fun, right now 21:49:13 but ive got bigger plans :) 21:49:20 be back later .. CD drive acting up 21:49:34 aight 21:53:57 * PWizard loves the typo on the isForth startup page. :) 21:56:56 ? 21:57:37 Direct Theaded 32 bit Linux Forth 21:57:47 unless "Theaded" makes sense.. ? 21:57:50 lol 21:58:06 --- quit: arke (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 21:58:49 I'm pretty good at making it segfault, too. Probably because I have no clue what I am doing. :-/; 22:03:28 --- join: arke (~chris@ca-cmrilo-cuda1-c3b-66.vnnyca.adelphia.net) joined #forth 22:04:10 back :) 22:04:22 arke again. :) 22:04:58 now im staying 22:05:00 lol 22:05:05 so, having fun? :) 22:05:10 what's up with your CDROM? 22:05:16 I've been crashing isForth. ;) 22:05:24 heehee 22:05:35 well, the old one is in a ... uum ... bad condition' 22:05:49 the tray is ripped out, and theres a bunch of loose parts inside 22:05:50 :) 22:06:27 hang on ?:) 22:06:47 man, what have you been doing with them? You know LP's won't fit in there, right? 22:08:14 PWizard: oh, that sucks. i thought they did... 22:08:19 :P 22:08:24 ;) 22:08:34 hey Mark, ever gonna make a new version of isforth? 22:08:45 cause if not, ill do some messing around with it ... :P 22:10:23 hang on... 22:10:45 hehehe 22:11:25 yes im gona do another version 22:11:35 but right now i cant log into my clss.net account 22:11:40 im trying to fix that 22:11:47 do you already have the new version done? 22:11:49 doh 22:11:56 o 22:11:58 oh 22:11:58 i have some minor changes yes 22:11:59 lol 22:12:00 :) 22:12:06 but not enough for a new version 22:12:10 hey, i might add a .f file for you... 22:12:21 whats something isforth doesnt have that it needs? 22:12:25 to do what ? 22:13:34 i could add some sockets, maybe 22:13:44 hows that? 22:13:47 i alredy have sockets heh 22:13:50 just not finished 22:14:04 im gona work on the resolver 22:14:12 and i have to hadd sendto and recievefrom 22:14:22 and thats reallly all thats needed 22:14:39 you looked at the irc bot in isforths source dir ? 22:14:55 uuh 22:14:58 theres an irc bot? 22:15:00 lol 22:15:34 --- join: [Forth] (~Forth@12-178.lctv-a5.cablelynx.com) joined #forth 22:15:37 thats it 22:15:55 wow 22:16:04 will the bot parse forth? 22:16:06 coded in isforth. 22:16:16 not yet 22:16:27 but thats why i wrote it 22:16:44 right now all it does is sit there and respond to server pings 22:16:49 thats ALL it responds to 22:16:55 [Forth]: greetings 22:16:57 :) 22:17:02 oh 22:17:05 thats yours not mine 22:17:08 how do i start it? 22:17:21 ./isforth -fload bot/bot.f 22:17:22 bot 22:17:26 hehhe, code looks nice 22:17:41 the numerics stuff needs rewriting 22:17:53 * arke needs to do something... 22:18:01 how about an X interface? lol 22:18:01 --- join: [arke] (~Forth@ca-cmrilo-cuda1-c3b-66.vnnyca.adelphia.net) joined #forth 22:18:10 [arke]: greetings 22:18:27 thats on the todo list but i dont think isforth is ready for it yet - but you can try 22:18:40 PWizard, what are you doing thats crashing isforth ? 22:18:51 well i was actually kidding...i dont know crap about X 22:18:52 :) 22:19:02 ok 22:19:02 me either :) 22:19:09 how do i tell teh bot to stop? 22:19:17 --- quit: [Forth] (Client Quit) 22:19:25 I440r: stupid things, like typing "list" right after the interpreter starts up 22:19:29 press an x key in the boths console 22:19:38 list ? 22:19:46 --- quit: [arke] (Client Quit) 22:19:47 I was guessing at random words 22:19:59 it segfaulted tho 22:20:01 random words wont segfault isforth 22:20:04 list _does_ segfault... 22:20:10 not for me 22:20:15 ./isforth 22:20:16 : list 22:20:16 list 22:20:16 cr tuck >block swap blksize@ 22:20:16 for 22:20:16 2dup type cr tuck + swap 22:20:18 nxt 22:20:20 and it segfaults ? 22:20:21 2drop ; 22:20:23 yep 22:20:28 ooh 22:20:53 lol that was a work in progress lol 22:21:02 none of it is trustworty 22:21:14 * I440r never does block source files... 22:21:20 but list was working before 22:21:25 heh 22:21:26 you have to have a block file open 22:21:32 and you have to tell it which block to list 22:21:48 PWizard, are you a forth newbie ? 22:21:51 I have no idea what a block is. I am green as hell 22:21:53 :D 22:21:57 yeah, newbie 22:21:58 heh 22:22:03 block files are horrible for sources 22:22:15 but they would be awesome for the help files 22:22:42 PWizard, do you code in any other languages ? 22:23:12 I440r: i can make you an assembler, i think. 22:23:29 C, ObjC, C++, Java, ASM (x86, 6502, 68000, Sparc, etc), little bit of perl and python, PHP, ummm.... 22:23:31 BASIC 22:23:51 PWizard, then you will have no problems with forth once you start getting to grips with it :) 22:23:57 I'm not very good at any of it though, except maybe assembler. :) 22:24:11 I440r: how do i insert an opcode in code? 22:24:12 :) 22:24:13 assembler is where i love to be 22:24:22 if i know that, i can make you the whole assembler 22:24:26 and I use an HP48gx, so I have the backwards stuff down nicely. :) 22:24:41 OWWWW!!!!!!!!! MY FINGER!!!!!! 22:24:44 arke when i know that ill show you heh 22:24:45 grrr 22:24:49 PWizard, cool 22:24:50 I440r: oh...lol 22:25:05 ive written an 8051 assembler tho 22:25:09 whats param? 22:25:21 and its similar tohow i want the x86 one to be 22:25:25 the word param ? 22:25:28 ye 22:25:28 I440r: hey, do you know some good sources I could peek at if I wanted to start making my own text editor in forth? 22:25:29 yep 22:25:44 PWizard: pygmy 22:25:46