00:00:00 --- log: started forth/03.10.31 00:55:03 --- quit: Serg_Penguin () 01:45:27 --- join: Serg_Penguin (~z@212.34.52.140) joined #forth 02:08:09 hi 02:08:32 hi-i-i ! 02:08:55 mur: do you have a forth for Z80 ? 02:09:21 no :/ 02:35:07 :(( 03:07:29 --- quit: Serg_Penguin () 04:16:06 --- quit: rO|xc ("Leaving") 05:38:37 --- join: Serg_Penguin (~z@212.34.52.140) joined #forth 06:14:14 serg! 06:16:35 --- join: onetom (~tom@160.114.27.135) joined #forth 06:21:43 hi mmanning ! 06:59:33 --- quit: Serg_Penguin () 08:16:12 --- join: jma (~jma@h-64-105-21-62.DNVTCO56.covad.net) joined #forth 09:07:17 --- quit: jma () 09:07:46 --- join: Herkamire (~jason@h000094d30ba2.ne.client2.attbi.com) joined #forth 09:08:26 --- quit: Herkamire (Client Quit) 09:38:43 --- join: yasam (~sam@210-54-228-233.dialup.xtra.co.nz) joined #forth 09:42:43 --- quit: rO| (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10:30:07 anyone here use forth for CGI? :) 10:32:39 --- quit: yasam ("dumdumdumdum") 11:54:27 im trying to set up some simple cgi stuff using isforth 12:00:02 I was curious if anyone had done it before 12:02:13 im sure they have. i eventually want to extend isforth so i can make it an apache module :) 12:06:00 :) 12:06:08 * MysticOne wants to get rid of perl 12:06:11 right now thats a pipe dream 12:06:23 though I don't know enough forth yet to do much useful stuff 13:12:53 --- join: rO| (test123@pD9EE127C.dip.t-dialin.net) joined #forth 13:13:00 hi 13:13:36 which bios interupt is for getting supported video modes? 13:17:56 --- join: jstahuman (dan@pcp053338pcs.brlngt01.nj.comcast.net) joined #forth 14:58:48 --- join: lma (~markus@lns-th2-13-82-64-79-125.adsl.proxad.net) joined #forth 14:59:47 hi there, 14:59:56 any hardware freaks on board? 16:11:09 --- quit: jstahuman ("leaving") 16:32:11 --- join: Sonarman (~matt@adsl-63-196-0-118.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 17:06:38 --- quit: lma (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 17:26:22 --- join: lma (~markus@lns-th2-10-82-64-145-238.adsl.proxad.net) joined #forth 18:25:13 --- join: kc5tja (~kc5tja@66-91-231-74.san.rr.com) joined #forth 18:25:13 --- mode: ChanServ set +o kc5tja 18:27:27 * kc5tja is thinking again about a good video architecture for his 6502 and 65816 computers. 18:27:35 * kc5tja wants something that's very simple, but yet, capable. 19:46:33 --- join: chodapp (1000@blackbird-day-216-68-113-122.fuse.net) joined #forth 19:48:01 Man, this candy is going out *fast*. I just got back on a restocking run, too. 19:51:28 Greetings . . . 20:04:29 Howdy 20:05:59 I'm extremely new to Forth, but I heard a lot of great things about it . . . and I got GForth working . . . 20:06:08 What are your views? What distinguishes it? 20:06:39 Well, it's concurrently the easiest to language to learn, and yet, the hardest to master. 20:06:47 (If you've ever played the game of Go, you'll know exactly what I mean) 20:06:53 I've heard C described similarly 20:07:52 Forth is a very zen language -- while other languages seek to create a mathematical abstraction of the machine you're programming, Forth seeks to expose the underlying hardware to a useful extent. 20:08:00 How does it compare as far as speed? 20:08:19 That depends on how the Forth system is implemented. 20:08:54 There are many different methods of implementing a Forth system. 20:09:05 Those that are native code often can at least match the speed of unoptimized C code. 20:09:32 Those that are implemented using "indirect threading" can be up to ten times slower. 20:10:14 I'm not sure what GForth is with respect to that . . . 20:10:28 It also depends on the hardware that it's running on. A Forth program running on an actual Forth processor will actually be faster than a comparable C program on that processor. 20:10:56 It's direct threaded, which is only subtly faster than indirect threaded. I'd say that it's performance is about 1/10th that of GCC for the equivalent program. 20:11:12 Ok. 20:11:22 Forth excels also at exceedingly small programs. 20:15:13 What sort of things do you use it for? 20:25:36 --- join: lmaa (~markus@lns-p19-11-82-65-192-202.adsl.proxad.net) joined #forth 20:25:47 --- quit: lma (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20:32:53 Me personally, or folks in general? 20:33:08 Personally, I'm going to use it as the operating system for a 6502 and 65816-based home-built computer. 20:33:30 Chuck Moore uses it for VLSI chip engineering. 20:33:42 (currently; he used to use it for radio telescope operations and data reduction) 20:33:53 Others use it for some digital signal processing. 20:34:14 I know Julian Noble, author of Scientific Forth, uses it in lieu of Fortran for all his scientific math requirements. 20:34:34 * chodapp glares at the thought of Fortran 20:34:45 * kc5tja was trying to use ColorForth earlier this evening to try and simulate a color palette, but it kept crashing on me. So I'll have to wait on that for a bit. 20:35:02 Unfortunately, Fortran is still quite huge in the scientific community. :( 20:35:12 Though, Matlab and related tools are gaining in popularity still. 20:35:56 I looked at Octave a little, but I never really used it 20:38:48 and probably I've never really used anything like Forth before, but I may as well try it 20:40:53 * kc5tja nods 20:41:26 Even if you don't like it, it's always good to learn a language that is fundamentally different from what you already know. I feel it helps you understand various programming patterns better. 20:41:33 Doggone it, we're getting rolling black-outs again... 20:41:50 and I used to write everything in BASIC, and I once wrote a program in Fortran, so I think it can't be much worse than that. 20:42:10 I agree to that . . . I think doing everything in a single language can really dull the mind 20:42:11 * kc5tja has to admit that there is a certain nicety to BASIC that no other language I've used has. 20:42:39 The immediacy and "quick, one-off-ness" of BASIC is its greatest asset. 20:43:20 * kc5tja once wrote a Wankel rotary engine visual simulator under QBasic once -- took me about a day's worth of coding. In Forth, I'm sure it would have taken me somewhat longer -- maybe three days or so. 20:44:29 --- quit: chodapp (Nick collision from services.) 20:45:01 --- join: chodapp (1000@blackbird-day-216-68-113-7.fuse.net) joined #forth 20:45:35 Gah . . . the stupid assbaskets at my ISP can't seem to keep a connection for more than 30 minutes at a time. 20:49:28 Heh 20:58:56 --- quit: chodapp ("Client Exiting") 21:01:59 --- join: I440r (~mark4@12-178.lctv-a5.cablelynx.com) joined #forth 21:10:20 Wow. By overloading the least significant bit of red intensity with the least significant bit of blue intensity (e.g., r0 == b0), I can get a wonderful 256 color palette that is a nice and balanced subset of a clean, 512 color palette. 21:11:14 I tried it with green, but green (because of our eye sensitivity) tends to discolor things a tiny bit. With red, it doesn't *appear* to discolor it. 22:10:58 Bedtime. 22:11:06 --- quit: kc5tja ("THX QSO ES 73 DE KC5TJA/6 CL ES QRT AR SK") 23:42:40 --- quit: Sonarman ("Lost terminal") 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/03.10.31