00:00:00 --- log: started forth/03.08.15
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00:16:53 <Serg_Penguin> kc5tja: you have big experience on multitasking things, yeah ?
00:21:32 <kc5tja> More or less, yes.
00:22:13 <Serg_Penguin> i wanna write my first threaded proggie, in perl, news downloader
00:22:33 <Serg_Penguin> how YOU would start it ? (i already wrote working non-th one)
00:24:03 <kc5tja> That's hard to answer because I am unfamiliar with Perl's multithreading facilities.
00:24:21 <kc5tja> but in general, for each major chunk of functionality, I'd write a mini-server of sorts.
00:24:35 <kc5tja> So each thread talks to each other via some kind of messaging system.
00:24:42 <Serg_Penguin> seems wise ;))
00:24:48 <Serg_Penguin> i think so:
00:24:50 <kc5tja> (it could be as simple as some shared variables protected by a lock of some kind)
00:25:45 <Serg_Penguin> 1) getting XHDR (Date, From, Subj) of messages and putting into hashes
00:26:33 <Serg_Penguin> 2) 3-5 threads taking results from 1), downloading bodies and putting assembled msg's in another hash
00:26:38 <kc5tja> GAHH!  Burned by the lack of type safety in C.
00:27:11 <kc5tja> How many concurrent connections to the news server are you allowed?
00:27:15 <Serg_Penguin> and erasing used data from XHDR's hashes
00:27:38 <Serg_Penguin> i'll put it in config variable, 1 to 5 maybe
00:27:49 <Serg_Penguin> if 1, use old version ;((
00:28:46 <Serg_Penguin> and 3) one thread what extracts messages from MSGS hash and writes them to file, in order of MSGNUM's on server
00:28:59 <Serg_Penguin> and erases from MSGS hash
00:29:31 <Serg_Penguin> so, it's like 'forked conveyor'
00:31:02 * kc5tja nods
00:31:20 <kc5tja> It's been a long time since I wrote any kind of multithreaded software.
00:31:38 <kc5tja> This chat client will be multithreaded, primarily because of the limitations of the GTK library.
00:31:47 <kc5tja> And the chat server will of course be multithreaded as well.
00:32:12 <Serg_Penguin> it's for slow home modems - on 128K ping doesn't matter ;))
00:34:13 <Serg_Penguin> yet another chat ? for what purpose ? why not IRC ?
00:34:31 <kc5tja> Because IRC sucks.
00:34:51 <Serg_Penguin> so what does it suck :))))))))) ?
00:35:23 <kc5tja> Tons of political bottlenecks, tons of servers that don't adhere strictly to IETF RFCs, tons of *clients* that don't adhere strictly to RFCs, netsplit issues, political battles between IRCops on the same network, and more.
00:35:57 <kc5tja> This is a project that I'm undertaking with a friend of mine.  He wanted his own chat system, so I'm helping him with it.
00:37:29 <Serg_Penguin> is it for internet or intra- ?
00:37:47 * Serg_Penguin wants a chat for our little company
00:39:17 <kc5tja> Both.
00:39:30 <kc5tja> I'm designing it for commercial as well as public use.
00:39:38 <kc5tja> I'm hoping that I'll get a little extra publicity for my company with it.
00:40:13 * rk is away: sleeeeeeeeeeeeeep
00:41:34 <kc5tja> A quick refactoring of the code, and then I'm out of here.
00:41:39 * kc5tja needs sleep too.
00:43:45 <Serg_Penguin> g00d nite !
00:53:51 <kc5tja> OK, program still works after the refactoring.  Going to bed.
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09:48:27 <kc5tja> re 
09:48:59 <Suzanne> hi kc
09:49:10 <Suzanne> sorry about not being around for a couple of days, got busy with various things
09:49:19 <kc5tja> That's OK.
09:49:50 <Suzanne> and of course, tried not to depend on the net too much yesterday/today :)
09:50:08 <kc5tja> Yeah, I need to get to work here, but I'm procrastinating, as usual.  :D
09:51:04 <Suzanne> i normally put off my procrastination til later :P
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09:51:52 <kc5tja> Well, I only woke up an hour ago, so it'll take another few hours before I'm fully aware of my surroundings.
09:52:17 <Suzanne> heh
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10:21:13 <onetom> Suzanne: hi
10:21:29 <Suzanne> hi onetom
10:22:32 <onetom> how does your 4th learning make headway?
10:23:13 <Suzanne> haven't done much in a couple of days
10:23:21 <Suzanne> (with forth)
10:23:54 <onetom> unfortunately me neither
10:24:12 <onetom> i failed linking 4th 2 directfb
10:24:22 <Suzanne> been working on an Objective-C app i hadn't touched for a month or two
10:24:35 <onetom> now im stucked w a c++ widgetset again..
10:24:36 <kc5tja> Wow!  Objective C!  I haven't heard that name in almost a year!
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10:26:39 <kc5tja> er a7r
10:26:40 <kc5tja> re even
10:27:22 <a7r> hey
10:31:39 <Suzanne> tch at /.
10:32:22 <Suzanne> they just posted a new item "WindowsUpdate.com falls on Sword (PLACEHOLDER)" then removed it straight away :)
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11:31:56 <kc5tja> well, i think i'm going to shower, get some food, and actually do some work for my client.
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12:26:00 <gilbertdeb> hi suzanne
12:26:10 <Suzanne> hi gilbert
12:26:35 <gilbertdeb> how's your forth?
12:26:51 <Suzanne> erm, dunno, haven't done anything with it since i was here last
12:26:57 <gilbertdeb> heheh.
12:26:58 <gilbertdeb> <hint>
12:27:11 <Suzanne> i'm hoping that left on its own, it's evolved into a full ANS implementation with no bugs, or something
12:27:20 <gilbertdeb> hahahah.
12:27:33 <gilbertdeb> Suzanne did you instruct it to evolve? ;)
12:27:41 <Suzanne> vaguely
12:32:36 <mur> gilbertdeb
12:32:37 <mur> :)
12:32:48 <gilbertdeb> Terve mur.
12:34:09 <Suzanne> gilbert, btw, was it you that asked me if i'd used scheme ?
12:34:25 <gilbertdeb> hmmm. not sure.
12:34:32 <gilbertdeb> but it might very well have been :D
12:34:41 <Suzanne> well, anyway, been playing with LispMe
12:34:46 <Suzanne> finally, a use for my palm :P
12:35:04 <gilbertdeb> how do you like it so far?
12:35:16 <Suzanne> its annoyingly different :P
12:37:14 <Suzanne> not sure i see the point of changing the words other than 'hey, lets mess with the heads of people'
12:37:14 <Suzanne> well, thats not true, i see the point of setq/setf->set!
12:37:14 <Suzanne> but things like = -> eq? are just weird
12:39:51 <gilbertdeb> and this is fully parenthesized lisp right?
12:42:28 <Suzanne> erm, not sure what you mean by that
12:45:11 <gilbertdeb> I mean they haven't changed the syntax around or anything
12:45:27 <Suzanne> not as far as i can tell
12:45:35 <Suzanne> but i'm no lisp-guru or anything
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13:08:18 <kc5tja> back
13:09:37 <kc5tja> Suzanne: Lisp's original words used eqp and nep and so on (predicates always ended with a 'p'), because of limitations of the computers used back then.
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13:43:18 <Suzanne> kc, actually, i knew that...
13:43:26 <Suzanne> kc, but still, eq? seems an odd choice
14:02:55 <kc5tja> Don't ask me.  I didn't write the language.
14:03:05 <Suzanne> didn't say you did :)
14:03:09 <kc5tja> I'm sure it probably has a lot to do with the implementation of Fortran at the time.
14:03:17 <Suzanne> just saying, odd choice, but still, a fun language on a little toy like a palm
14:03:27 <kc5tja> Punch cards are pretty limited in their available character sets.  :)
14:03:47 * kc5tja uses the Palm for more than just a toy.  My business would collapse without it.  :)
14:03:51 <Suzanne> (and yes, if i had a Tungsten-C i wouldn't call it a toy, but a crappy dragonball is very much a toy :)
14:04:03 * kc5tja just has a crappy dragonball.
14:04:09 <kc5tja> No ARM for me.
14:04:14 <Suzanne> kc, i have a VIIx, i'm sure that tells you how much of a usable machine it is :P
14:04:28 <Suzanne> actually, scratch that, its a plain VII
14:04:35 <Suzanne> worst palm, evah!
14:12:55 <TreyB> Hey!  I work for PalmSource, and I have a VIIx.
14:13:45 <Suzanne> trey, my sympathies :P
14:13:59 <Suzanne> actually, the x had more memory didn't it ?
14:14:12 <TreyB> I also have an Intel XScale prototype board and the source to PalmOS 6 ;-)
14:14:13 <Suzanne> so the x is probably more usable than the regular VII
14:14:42 <TreyB> I just use my VIIx for phone numbers and my grocery list.
14:15:24 <Suzanne> actually, i wouldn't mind the VII so much if you could just stop it charging the damned wireless
14:15:36 <TreyB> Yeah :-(
14:15:51 <TreyB> I got it as a freebie when I joined Palm.
14:16:00 <Suzanne> ah, it was a gift, in my case
14:16:11 <Suzanne> i questioned 'why the VII?' at the time, but oh well
14:16:14 <TreyB> So we can't really complain too much, can we?
14:16:25 * Suzanne shrugs
14:16:29 <Suzanne> its never stopped me before :P
14:17:16 * kc5tja has a Clie SJ-30 I think.
14:17:29 <kc5tja> Color, 16MB of RAM, 320x320 resolution.
14:17:38 <TreyB> Sony makes nice toys.
14:17:43 <Suzanne> kc, see, that 16MB is where my VII fails :P
14:17:49 <Suzanne> 2MB on the VII
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14:18:04 <kc5tja> Suzanne: I have 14MB free, and that's only because of some software that's installed that I don't use anymore.
14:18:06 <Suzanne> which is practically useless, given that half of it is loaded up with Yahoo! searches and other useless junk :P
14:19:11 <kc5tja> Anyway, brb
14:23:24 <kc5tja> back
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14:47:19 <kc5tja> re
14:48:28 <Forther> hello
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14:49:37 <kc5tja> Having issues?  :)
14:49:48 <Forther> always.
14:50:22 <Forther> trying out some options on my IRC client.
14:50:27 <kc5tja> Ahh
14:50:41 <Forther> trying to get connected to two different servers at once, may support, may not, working it out.
14:50:49 <Forther> will come and go here a bit trying I'm sure.
14:51:13 * kc5tja nods
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14:56:11 <SDO> hmmmmmmmm, new client.
14:56:14 <SDO> interesting.
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15:02:07 <SDO> Hi there, what up doc?
15:02:09 <SDO> You and me make a nice pair of 
15:03:01 <SDO> Hi there!
15:03:01 <SDO> How you doing?
15:03:02 <SDO> I'm feeling great today!
15:03:02 <SDO> I'm testing out the function key 'canned' answers and questions feature.
15:03:03 <SDO> What time of the day is it where you're located?
15:03:03 <SDO> How old are you?
15:03:03 <SDO> What sex are you?
15:03:07 <SDO> ok, they seem to work.
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15:05:03 * Suzanne hits SDO with the 'a/s/l better not be next' stick :P
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15:05:51 <SDO> LOL
15:06:09 <SDO> I was thinking of the asl thing when I did the function key filling.  I'll remove them now that they work :)
15:06:43 <SDO> Now only have 2 function keys programmed :)
15:06:44 <SDO> Hi there!
15:06:45 <SDO> How you doing?
15:06:50 <SDO> there we go, pretty generic.
15:16:32 <kc5tja> What the heck is asl?
15:17:06 <kc5tja> To me, 'asl' means arithmetic shift left.  
15:18:51 <SDO> I think it means age, sex and location
15:19:01 <SDO> meaning a pickup line for dudes that want to get a piece of some young pie.
15:19:34 <SDO> It is generally a sign of disgusting wet dream materials of slobbery unshaven and washed 30-50 year old men left over from the BBS ages.
15:23:02 <SDO> (deadly silence hits the room, maybe I have stuck a nerve :)
15:33:53 <Suzanne> kc, 'age, sex, location', usually used just before harassing someone :P
15:36:55 <mur> a/s/l is teenager expreesssion
15:37:11 <mur> a/s/l  100/female/ YOUR GRANDMA!!
15:37:12 <mur> ;)
15:37:43 <mur> or 40/male/Home GO TO SLEEP NOW!!
15:37:44 <mur> ;)
15:41:53 <kc5tja> Ahh
15:41:58 * kc5tja never heard that before.
15:42:57 <mur> bleassed are you
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17:09:27 <suprdupr> http://www.ynet.com.au/sean/map0.html
17:10:07 <suprdupr> kinda weird
17:10:09 <suprdupr> ;pp
17:11:20 <gilbertdeb> was it the fumes again?
17:11:23 <gilbertdeb> am I missing something?
17:11:26 <gilbertdeb> am I too clean?
17:11:35 <gilbertdeb> I'm not gonna inherit the earth am i?
17:12:09 <Suzanne> gilbert, the odds are against it
17:12:17 <gilbertdeb> hehehe.
17:12:25 <gilbertdeb> suprdupr have you seen prograph?
17:12:29 <gilbertdeb> or used it yet?
17:12:30 <suprdupr> nope
17:14:31 <gilbertdeb> well suprdupr congratulations. Now there is a basis of sorts for all those screen shots of hackers in movies manipulating images .
17:14:34 <gilbertdeb> you know what i mean ...
17:15:27 <gilbertdeb> what does Hello World look like?
17:15:35 <gilbertdeb> and the factorial function?
17:22:07 <kc5tja> Is it just me, or are neither of you making any sense whatsoever?
17:22:22 <gilbertdeb> Its currently a monologue.
17:22:34 <kc5tja> Ahh
17:22:35 <kc5tja> :)
17:22:38 <kc5tja> Anyway, I'm out.  Aikido.
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17:28:00 <suprdupr> gilbertdb: stop doing crack
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19:33:33 <TheBlueWizard> hiya all
19:33:37 <gilbertdeb> hi
19:33:53 <TheBlueWizard> hiya gilbertdeb
19:41:24 <TheBlueWizard> gotta go...bye all
19:41:43 * rk considers making a new portable forth
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19:52:47 <rk> but no ."
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21:51:37 <kc5tja> Well, I just had a fun experience.
21:51:47 <gilbertdeb> Did the bird come back?
21:51:53 <kc5tja> I just get back from aikido, and some moron just walks into my apartment.
21:52:10 <kc5tja> So I grab my bokken, and hold him at sword-point before he even had a chance to do anything.
21:52:32 <gilbertdeb> ???
21:52:37 <gilbertdeb> what was he doing there?
21:52:45 <gilbertdeb> maybe the poor fellow was lost!
21:52:46 <kc5tja> The look on his face was absolutely classic once he realized that it was a real sword, despite being made of wood.  :)
21:53:12 <kc5tja> I felt more comfortable keeping him under control before asking questions.
21:53:27 <kc5tja> He "claims" that he was looking for a party in an apartment, and obviously this isn't it.
21:53:46 <kc5tja> I said, "Yep!  You're correct.  Now, if you would, I'd like for you to leave, and please do not come back."
21:54:07 <gilbertdeb> he just opened the door and walked in?
21:54:10 <gilbertdeb> or was the door open?
21:54:10 <kc5tja> And with that, he said, "Sure, man, just don't hurt anyone!" and walked out.  :)
21:54:12 <kc5tja> YEAH!
21:54:16 <kc5tja> The door was closed.
21:54:30 <kc5tja> I was like, "Dude, WTF?!  Don't you ever KNOCK first?"
21:54:42 <gilbertdeb> heheh
21:55:39 <kc5tja> Believe me, I was just as scared as he was.  I don't like putting people in those situations.  What if he had a gun?
21:55:52 <gilbertdeb> thats right.
21:56:05 <kc5tja> But, not much else I could have done.
21:56:21 <kc5tja> I'd rather have the fighting chance of whacking him a solid one if he tried to pull.
21:57:47 <gilbertdeb> I bet on an IRC channel called #dudewheresthepartyat he is narrating his side of the story over a cold one.
21:58:19 <kc5tja> Well, that's none of my business.
21:58:25 <rk> hee
21:58:26 <kc5tja> I just wanted him right out of my house.
21:58:27 <kc5tja> Period.
21:58:36 <gilbertdeb> ah it was a joke.
21:58:44 * rk tries to find an ANSI Forth reference or whatever
21:59:07 <kc5tja> rk: If you google for "dpans" you'll find the ANSI specifciation.
22:12:23 <rk> thanks
22:13:01 <rk> :)
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