00:00:00 --- log: started forth/03.08.09
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01:29:12 * rk is away: zZzZzZzZzZzZzZzZzZzZz .... whatever you say Vash ... I can't see it .....
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03:45:39 <Forther> http://www.ece.cmu.edu/~koopman/stack_computers/index.html
03:46:05 <Forther> just another stack computer/language book online for FREE, .html/pdf, purchase :)
03:46:14 <Forther> believe it covers FORTH also
03:46:16 <Forther> enjoy!
03:46:19 <Forther> FREE, yippie!
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06:31:07 <Speuler> i'm was just doing  strings /proc/kcore, found a number of astonishing things there... example:
06:31:30 <Speuler> BIOS.4TH
06:31:30 <Speuler> BIOS.4T!
06:31:30 <Speuler> NetBIOS.txt.gz
06:31:30 <Speuler> BIOS.4TH
06:31:32 <Speuler> BIOS.4T!
06:31:35 <Speuler> BIOS
06:31:38 <Speuler> BIOS.COM
06:31:40 <Speuler> Broken BIOS or DOS TSR
06:32:21 <Speuler>         CR ." searching ROM BIOS extensions ..."                     \
06:32:22 <Speuler> BIOS.4TH
06:32:22 <Speuler> BIOS.4TH
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07:33:53 <Stepan> re
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08:54:50 <DarkTriforce> ::yawn::
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09:52:03 <Stepan> re
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10:59:17 <a7r> re..
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14:39:13 <TheBlueWizard> hiya all
14:39:21 <gilbertdeb> hi TBW
14:40:51 <TheBlueWizard> hiya gilbertdeb
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15:24:06 <TheBlueWizard> hiya I440r!!!! :)))
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15:25:47 <I440r_> tbw!!!
15:26:20 <TheBlueWizard> how's life?
15:26:44 <I440r_> not too bad. no job still tho :/
15:28:38 <TheBlueWizard> aww....2 years no job, eh?
15:29:11 <I440r_> :/
15:29:13 <I440r_> it sux
15:30:42 * TheBlueWizard nods glumly...and doesn't know of a way to help poor little soul, short of making him bite the bullet and do some *cough* "popular language" programming
15:32:26 * TheBlueWizard is still busy...and still has a job, even though he dislikes it
15:32:39 <I440r_> im owrkin on it heh
15:32:50 <I440r_> im developing an umbilical 8051 forth
15:34:03 <TheBlueWizard> umbilical? as in embryonic?
15:34:08 <I440r_> and Keil are interested in it (maybe :)
15:34:09 <I440r_> heh
15:34:14 <I440r_> no. 
15:34:21 <I440r_> the 8051 kernel sits on the 8051 target.
15:34:26 <I440r_> there are no creating words on the target
15:34:39 <I440r_> you have a host forth where you do all the creating. so all headers etc are on the host
15:34:59 <gilbertdeb> who is kiel?
15:35:05 <TheBlueWizard> interesting...a variation on turnkey programming
15:35:06 <I440r_> when you compile into the target vocabulary your compiling ON the target
15:35:15 <I440r_> keil make a $3000 8051 assembler and c compiler
15:35:35 <I440r_> its not my invention :)
15:35:48 <TheBlueWizard> $3000 is a lot in my book
15:35:49 <gilbertdeb> Mmmhmm.
15:35:55 <I440r_> its over-priced
15:35:56 <I440r_> lol
15:36:02 <TheBlueWizard> :)
15:36:07 <gilbertdeb> why would anyone pay for their stuff on that ancient processor?
15:36:14 <I440r_> but look at most 8051 c compilers and thats about what you pay
15:36:31 <I440r_> gilbert not only is it not ancient its also the most widly used microcontroler in existance
15:36:52 <gilbertdeb> it is the intel 8051 right?
15:37:00 * TheBlueWizard nods...and notes that embedded programming industry is often filled with strange, expensive stuff
15:37:06 <I440r_> www.cygnal.com  <-- check that out
15:37:19 <I440r_> a hell of alot of different companies make 8051 variants
15:38:02 <I440r_> the 8051 is both cheap AND powerfull
15:38:08 <I440r_> specially those cygnal devices :)
15:38:25 * TheBlueWizard is viewing it now
15:38:54 <I440r_> im developing this forth on an F015
15:39:20 <I440r_> i already have a non umbilical version of the compiler in 8k
15:39:26 <I440r_> thats the compiler and the assembler extension
15:39:47 <I440r_> so the target does all its own compiling and writes all new definitions directly into flash :)
15:40:47 <gilbertdeb> so I440r_ did you just email them with a subject: "Boy do I have a forth for you!"?
15:40:57 <I440r_> no
15:41:16 <I440r_> actually i sort of borrowed their $3000 dollar assembler and then asked them if i could release it.
15:41:32 <I440r_> they offered to GIVE me a lisense for free if they thunked the project was worth it
15:41:48 <gilbertdeb> but that is 0 $$$ for you!
15:41:52 <I440r_> actually though the way it works not im not using their assembler to compile the kernel
15:42:08 <I440r_> but unless they OK it im not releasing it
15:42:19 <I440r_> because i borrowed their assembler to begin with
15:42:37 <gilbertdeb> what did you need their asm for If I may ask?
15:42:40 <I440r_> i mailed the non umbilical version to a guy there and he is now out of the office till the t2th
15:42:47 <I440r_> to develop the kernel
15:42:53 <I440r_> the 8051 kernel
15:43:06 <gilbertdeb> yes yes, but did you just up and say you wanted to write one?
15:43:07 <I440r_> it wasnt untill after i had that up and running that i decided to go umbilical
15:43:20 <I440r_> i wrote an assembler extension for it
15:43:24 <I440r_> i ported isforth to dos heh
15:43:33 <I440r_> and extended IT with the 8051 assembler
15:43:44 <I440r_> and now im TARGET compiling the 8051 kernel
15:43:44 <gilbertdeb> to dos??
15:43:49 <I440r_> thats not fully working yet
15:43:50 <I440r_> yes
15:44:21 <gilbertdeb> you have sinned and fallen short of the glory of Open Source ;)
15:44:29 <gilbertdeb> thou musteth repenteth.
15:44:40 <TheBlueWizard> lol
15:44:50 <I440r_> actually the dos port is ported to be assembled with the registered version of a86
15:44:51 <I440r_> a386
15:45:08 <I440r_> and with THAT i can assemble each word linked to the correct thread in a vocabulary
15:45:25 <I440r_> so it does hashed lookups right after assembly
15:45:36 <I440r_> the macros to do this are way more complex than the ones in the linux nasm sources
15:45:42 <I440r_> you couldnt do this with nasm very easilly
15:45:54 <I440r_> tho now taht ive done it here im gona try with nasm ehh
15:45:56 <gilbertdeb> I440r_ due to nasm or due to dos?
15:46:14 <I440r_> due to nasm
15:46:32 <I440r_> a386 is absolutely the BEST assembler ever written for ANY processor
15:46:34 <I440r_> BAR NONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
15:46:40 <gilbertdeb> yes thats what I heard.
15:46:41 * TheBlueWizard recalls dealing with NASM macro facility (at least the 0.94 version anyway) and decides it really sux
15:46:45 <gilbertdeb> but it must be paid for right?
15:47:00 <I440r_> yes
15:47:06 <I440r_> but then... i DID pay for it :)
15:47:15 <I440r_> im prolly not releasing teh dos port
15:47:31 <gilbertdeb> how much does asm86 cost?
15:47:40 <I440r_> for the 8051 project you will probably be sealed into some vic
15:47:44 <I440r_> its a86
15:47:49 <I440r_> check out www.eji.com
15:48:39 <TheBlueWizard> vic?
15:48:48 <I440r_> ?
15:49:16 <gilbertdeb> wow!
15:49:24 <TheBlueWizard> you said "...be sealed into some vic"
15:49:34 <I440r_> voc
15:49:37 <I440r_> vocabulary
15:49:41 <I440r_> mistype
15:49:42 <TheBlueWizard> ah
15:50:50 * TheBlueWizard wishes I440r_ luck....and thinks he might ask to get employed at the said company ;)
15:51:06 <TheBlueWizard> s/might/should/...hmmm
15:51:22 <gilbertdeb> I440r_ have you ever used fasm?
15:51:40 <I440r_> nope
15:51:46 <I440r_> i looked at it but didnt like it much
15:52:15 <I440r_> you CANNOT beat a386 - specially when you also have a86lib :)
15:53:00 <I440r_> i asked eji if he would port it to linux but he said he wasnt interested in doing that
15:53:45 <gilbertdeb> why not?
15:55:32 <I440r_> he doesnt do linux :)
15:55:41 <gilbertdeb> just dos?
15:56:00 <TheBlueWizard> hmm...eji's loss :)
15:56:17 <I440r_> yup
15:59:31 <TheBlueWizard> someone may eventually clone a386...or a better x86 assembler will appear...whatever.  IMHO NASM is pretty good assembler with respect to syntax, even though it has/had bugs, awkward macro architecture, ...*sigh*
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16:37:20 <TheBlueWizard> hiya Suzanne
16:37:47 <Suzanne> hi
16:38:11 <TheBlueWizard> gotta go...bye all
16:38:17 <gilbertdeb> hi Suzanne
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16:40:19 <Suzanne> that is uncanny
16:40:33 <Suzanne> i just did s" hello" .S in gforth...
16:40:48 <Suzanne> and got exactly the same address on the stack as i had 10 seconds earlier in my own forth :P
16:41:13 <gilbertdeb> your own forth?
16:41:16 <gilbertdeb> what is your own forth?
16:41:30 <Suzanne> the one i've been writing since about 2pm this afternoon :P
16:42:28 <gilbertdeb> in what?
16:42:40 <Suzanne> C
16:42:46 <gilbertdeb> huh?
16:42:51 <gilbertdeb> no objC? ;)
16:43:54 <Suzanne> actually, i'm not entirely sure that Objective-C would make it any easier
16:43:55 <gilbertdeb> I thought in the book of Suzanne, vs 23 subsection Order of preference item a) Languages sub item a) Formal i. Objc comes before C!
16:44:15 * gilbertdeb refers.
16:44:18 <Suzanne> gilbert, yes, if there is anything to gain from Objective-C
16:44:22 <gilbertdeb> :)
16:44:32 <Suzanne> which there almost always is
16:44:48 <Suzanne> but not really in a 200 line piece of code :P
16:45:04 <gilbertdeb> Hrmmm.
16:45:17 <gilbertdeb> shrimp curry does not go too well with couscous.
16:45:25 <gilbertdeb> it goes, but ... :|
16:45:27 <Suzanne> yes it does :P
16:45:47 <gilbertdeb> well, instead of shrimps I used northern beans and sweet peas.
16:45:50 <gilbertdeb> I had just run out.
16:46:04 <Suzanne> it might have a similar affect to baked beans, later on, mind you
16:46:23 <gilbertdeb> Hmmmm.
16:46:44 <gilbertdeb> I'll warn my roommates.
16:46:52 <gilbertdeb> hell, I'll just get them to try it too.
16:47:02 <gilbertdeb> so how far along is your forth?
16:48:10 <Suzanne> not very, really
16:48:15 <gilbertdeb> oh, Suzanne have you ever used Snobol?
16:48:28 <Suzanne> once upon a time, yes
16:48:34 <Suzanne> but i can't remember anything about it
16:48:47 <Suzanne> (other than borrowing a book out of the library on it out of curiosity)
16:55:16 <Suzanne> btw, as to how far along my forth is:
16:55:17 <Suzanne> suzanne@g3serv Forth]$ ./ft
16:55:17 <Suzanne> words
16:55:17 <Suzanne> bye . + - * / .S dup swap ( s" type cr .( words 
16:55:24 <Suzanne> not very impressive, is it, really ?
16:55:42 <gilbertdeb> Suzanne as long as it can bootstrap forth...
16:55:48 <gilbertdeb> thats all that really matters no?
16:55:56 <Suzanne> it doesn't support : ... ; yet
16:56:55 <gilbertdeb> soon enough.
17:34:21 <ian_p> you're farther than i ever got
17:34:24 <ian_p> ;D
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17:35:53 <Suzanne> now it nearly supports : ... ;
17:38:22 <Suzanne> see:
17:38:23 <Suzanne> words
17:38:23 <Suzanne> bye . + - * / .s dup swap s" type cr .( @ ! words 2dup : 
17:38:23 <Suzanne> : test 2 3 + . ;
17:38:24 <Suzanne> defining test
17:38:25 <Suzanne> words
17:38:29 <Suzanne> bye . + - * / .s dup swap s" type cr .( @ ! words 2dup : test 
17:38:32 <Suzanne> :)
17:38:38 <gilbertdeb> good job!
17:38:58 <Suzanne> ok, so it doesn't actually DO anything with the bit after : test  yet :)
17:39:24 <Suzanne> i have to work out how i'm going to build the token string up
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22:22:26 <jma> anyone here used colorForth yet?
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