00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.12.14
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04:28:55 <gTs2> yo
04:36:21 <Robert> Hi.
04:37:09 <gTs2> how old are you?
04:37:12 <gTs2> i'm 22
04:38:27 * Robert <-- 16.
04:40:01 <gTs2> cool
04:40:38 <Robert> :)
04:41:49 <gTs2> wish i had the brains to deal with forth when i was a teen
04:42:12 <gTs2> but due to the educational system here you are required to bust your balls till you're 18 and study to get in university
04:42:37 <Robert> :-/
04:42:47 <Robert> Come to Sweden instead.
04:45:34 <fridge> when I was 8 or 10
04:45:43 <fridge> I programmed basic for a bit
04:45:55 <fridge> then lost all interest in computers until I was 18
04:46:15 <Robert> I started when I was 11.
04:46:27 <Robert> Never lost the interest for more than a few weeks :)
04:48:50 <fridge> I'm learning forth & PPC asm at the moment
04:48:57 <Robert> Neat.
04:49:08 <Robert> I'm getting into microcontrollers, but I've always been using x86.
04:50:38 <gTs2> when i was <16 i just played games and toyed with Technics/turbo pascal
04:50:42 <fridge> Work is a bit distracting from all the fun computer stuff
04:50:48 <gTs2> nowadays i enjoy programming on my calculator
04:50:59 <gTs2> in fact, i am thinking of rewriting it's os to be forth
04:51:10 <gTs2> (it currently is rpl. which is like forth and lisp)
04:51:19 <Robert> :)
04:52:57 <gTs2> you do know hp calculators, right
04:53:01 <gTs2> ?
04:53:06 <Robert> No, never used one.
04:53:20 * Robert has a TI82.
04:53:21 <gTs2> shaaaaame on you
04:53:24 <Robert> Heh.
04:53:25 <gTs2> www.hpcalc.org
04:53:28 <gTs2> ACK
04:53:29 <gTs2> TI
04:53:31 <Robert> Programming is for PCs.
04:53:32 <gTs2> DIE DIE DIE
04:53:39 <Robert> Simple calculations for calculators.
04:53:48 <gTs2> that what i said too, until i got my gx
04:54:17 <fridge> thaha
04:54:25 <gTs2> asm/rpl/sysrpl/c/pascal
04:57:29 <gTs2> you ever play games?
04:57:45 <Robert> A few times a year, yes.
04:58:18 <gTs2> wow
04:58:22 <gTs2> :|
04:59:19 <gTs2> other priorities?
05:00:16 <Robert> Erm.
05:00:18 <fridge> IRC
05:00:22 <Robert> Exactly.
05:00:24 <fridge> priority #1
05:00:28 <Robert> IRC is my social life.
05:00:37 <Robert> Coding and reading is the other half of my life.
05:00:57 <gTs2> duh
05:01:13 <gTs2> wth do you mean irc is your social life
05:01:20 <gTs2> irc can't be "social life"
05:01:33 <gTs2> you mean it substitutes your inexistant social life
05:01:37 <gTs2> which is ga
05:01:41 <gTs2> y
05:01:45 <gTs2> get out of your house for a while
05:01:47 <fridge> haaha
05:01:49 <fridge> naah
05:01:52 <gTs2> AND BEST IT NOT BE TO BUY NEW HARDWARE
05:01:56 <fridge> all my friends go to nightclubs
05:02:01 <fridge> it annoys me to death
05:02:03 <gTs2> no
05:02:07 <gTs2> not nightclubs
05:02:10 <fridge> I just sent my gf off with her friends
05:02:11 <gTs2> screw nightclubs
05:02:15 <Robert> I rarley buy new hardware.
05:02:17 <gTs2> go got a coffee or somehing
05:02:21 <fridge> so I can sit home tonight and relax
05:02:25 <Robert> I don't drink coffee.
05:02:29 <fridge> with a book on forth, a beer & my laptop
05:02:36 <gTs2> a juice
05:02:43 <gTs2> a beer
05:02:48 <Robert> I don't have any Forth books.
05:02:53 <Robert> I don't drink beer.
05:02:58 <Robert> And I don't have any juice.
05:03:04 <fridge> do you have a laptop?
05:03:09 <Robert> But... I can drink some water.
05:03:11 <gTs2> i don't have a laptop
05:03:14 <gTs2> which i did tho
05:03:18 <Robert> I have a 286 and a 486 laptop.
05:03:31 <gTs2> er "wish" i did
05:03:34 <fridge> ooot
05:03:38 <gTs2> eeek
05:04:19 <gTs2> what about you fridge
05:04:51 <fridge> I work
05:05:09 <fridge> doing sysad and some python coding
05:05:11 <gTs2> don't worry.
05:05:15 <fridge> neither of which I'm enjoyng much
05:05:15 <gTs2> you'll get over it.
05:05:25 <fridge> need a holiday
05:06:02 <fridge> luckily I'm having one soon
05:07:33 <gTs2> good for you
05:08:26 <gTs2> so. 
05:08:35 <gTs2> anything interesting to discuss/
05:13:29 <gTs2> :|
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07:32:19 <Robert> :)
07:37:03 <fridge> neat trick
07:39:18 <Speuler> the phenix  from ash thing ?
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08:45:48 <Herkamire> anybody played with inputting text with about 7 buttons, where you push a bunch at once to get different characters? (I think it's called "chorded")
08:46:36 <Herkamire> I am interested in having something like that on a handheld, but I want to try it first, so I implemented something to do it on the linux console
08:48:21 <Herkamire> I have a button under each finger, and a choice of 3 buttons for my thumb
08:49:42 <Herkamire> I've got 60 different chars in one press
08:51:06 <Herkamire> I figure I'll need to tap just a thumb button to be a shift or some sort of modifier to get capitals, and funky characters. There would be enough slots left too, that I could have a whole table of words that I could get by tapping a thumb button and hitting a combo
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08:55:41 <onetom_> did u play w termio/ioctl?
08:57:00 <Herkamire> onetom_: yeah
08:57:15 <Herkamire> I had to do tcsetattr and ioctl
08:57:21 <onetom_> i was 2 lazy 2 play w them :)
08:57:52 <Herkamire> it's good to have another linux machine around for when you #$@!## up and leave your terminal in raw mode
08:58:15 <onetom_> i havent found a comprehensive, architectural & ideological description about this term shit
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08:58:53 <Herkamire> onetom_: you mean the ioctls and scancodes and stuff?
08:58:57 <onetom_> what wrong w using screen?
08:59:17 <Herkamire> onetom_: huh? you mean writing to the framebuffer?
08:59:44 <onetom_> ioctls, scancodes, escape sequences ... but mainly the whole picture is missing
09:00:04 <onetom_> there r listings, references everywhere
09:00:27 <onetom_> framebuffer?!?? nooo! apt-get install screen
09:00:40 <onetom_> a tty "multiplexer" app
09:01:19 <onetom_> & aint u tryin this stuff under X?
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09:01:47 <Herkamire> onetom: no, it wouldn't let me set the keyboard to raw mode under X
09:02:06 <Herkamire> I don't know how to get keyups under X
09:02:06 <onetom> hmm.. sounds strange...
09:02:30 <onetom> try xev ;)
09:02:36 <Herkamire> plus tathi wants to play with it too, and he doesn't have x
09:02:51 <onetom> anyway, i dont even know how 2 play w the keyb interface of X
09:03:12 <onetom> but we were talkin about the terminal
09:03:16 <Herkamire> heh :) me neither. I could do it whith SDL :)
09:03:35 <onetom> switching 2 raw mode should also work under xterm/rxvt/whatever
09:03:50 <Herkamire> didn't under xterm
09:04:03 <Herkamire> showkey wouldn't run
09:04:16 <onetom> strange strange strange...
09:04:18 <Herkamire> I got it all figured out in the terminal
09:04:26 <Herkamire> one thing took me forever to figure out.
09:04:33 <onetom> i hate this whole os-centric world more & more
09:05:00 <onetom> in dos, i can easily write a keyb routine in some line even in asm or pascal
09:05:04 <Herkamire> for quite a while when I pushed a key "Quit" would be printed and my program would exit.
09:05:37 <onetom> but in x or term... its terribly over complicated
09:05:54 <Herkamire> took me forever to realize that the return keydown or something was sending the code for SIGQUIT and the terminal was translating it, and sending me SIGQUIT signal
09:06:26 <onetom> great :)
09:06:35 <Herkamire> so I had to unsed ISIG flag with tcsetattr
09:06:50 <onetom> anyway, im also interested in playin w alternative inputs
09:06:57 <onetom> very very much
09:07:47 <Herkamire> you want C code?
09:08:00 <onetom> sure
09:08:27 <onetom> ooor, what is the question exactly?
09:09:04 <onetom> do i would like u 2 send me the C src of ur experiments u did so far?
09:09:15 <onetom> the answer is yes
09:15:10 <Herkamire> C code for getting the terminal in raw state
09:20:26 <Herkamire> my code for parsing for chorded input is in fpos. That's easy to translate though.
09:23:54 <Herkamire> onetom: "kdb_mode -a" will make your terminal usable again if you get a crash while in raw mode
09:24:14 <onetom> aha
09:27:04 <Herkamire> I found that my keydown for the tab key was a return, and keyup was A-umlout.
09:27:31 <Herkamire> so I made an: alias <A-umlout>="kbd_mode -a"
09:27:41 <Herkamire> so I could get my terminal back by hammering the tab key
09:27:56 <Herkamire> it's probably a different key on yours. maybe =
09:28:26 <Herkamire> http://herkamire.homeip.net:3/rawkeyboard.c
09:31:59 <Herkamire> the high bit get's set for keyups
09:32:27 <Herkamire> I didn't see anything in printf to print a number in binary, so it's hard to see that
09:39:22 <Herkamire> this is in our funky colorforth syntax, but if you're really curious...
09:39:25 <Herkamire> http://herkamire.homeip.net:3/chorded.fs
09:40:12 <Herkamire> it makes more sense with this vim mode:
09:40:15 <Herkamire> http://herkamire.homeip.net:3/svn/jason/.vim/syntax/colorforth.vim
09:43:33 <onetom> :3 lol
09:44:12 <Herkamire> the main eccentricities, are the a register, and that normal fetches and stores (anything without an "s" or "r" postfix) go from the a register
09:44:37 <Herkamire> and there's a couple of prefixes: & defines a variable $ means hex and # means decimal
09:45:46 <Herkamire> I think tathi is going to change it so ! and @ use the stack, and !a @a etc use the a register.
09:46:11 <Herkamire> are you laughing at my vim mode? :)
09:47:00 <onetom> no, just the port number
09:47:17 <onetom> im working @ the moment, so i dont have much time
09:47:23 <Herkamire> what is 3 supposed to be?
09:47:29 <onetom> but ive dled the stuff & gonna try it
09:47:35 <Herkamire> you can use 5000 if you want :)
09:47:43 <onetom> ur color syntax is not silly @ all
09:48:23 <onetom> tho, im still not familiar w the color4th idioms
09:48:28 <Herkamire> cool :) we did what made sense at the time, and we are simplifying it a little. like doing away with #
09:49:02 <Herkamire> oh, and ; does not end a definition 
09:49:19 <onetom> it shouldnt of coz ;)
09:49:52 <onetom> i definitely love the ... if ... ; then ... ; construct
09:50:19 <Herkamire> yeah :) and if you have tail recursion thing built into the ; you get some great loops too :)
09:50:21 <onetom> im studying the latest enth&flux nowdays
09:50:38 <onetom> i think im gonna code in that later
09:50:52 <onetom> under vmware or bochs...
09:50:54 <Herkamire> is that one language or two?
09:51:03 <onetom> 2
09:51:15 <Herkamire> why code under bochs?
09:51:24 <onetom> enth is the ans base 4 the colored flux "variant"
09:51:28 <Herkamire> bochs was bloody slow when I tried it
09:51:56 <Herkamire> what's it like? URL?
09:52:23 <onetom> but it allows me 2 use os - like enth - inside my linux ran 4 the regular & everyday task, like irc ;)
09:52:47 <onetom> http://www.ynet.com.au/sean/
09:53:04 <onetom> u should have a look @ the SOURCE.HTML inside the zip.. ;)
09:53:31 <Herkamire> enth is an OS?
09:53:45 <Herkamire> is flux an os?
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09:54:08 <onetom> neither of them ;)û
09:54:17 <onetom> infact both
09:54:26 <onetom> its the same system
09:54:46 <onetom> bootable & b able 2 run on a bare x86 iron
09:55:19 <onetom> but hey, dont call forth-over-iron systems os-es
09:55:53 <onetom> @least not here on #forth ;)
09:56:54 <Herkamire> can it boot off a floppy?
09:57:32 <Herkamire> I say anything that boots and lets you use your computer is an OS
10:00:36 <Herkamire> anything tricky I have to do to get it to run under bochs?
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12:02:16 <gTs2> hey!
12:03:09 <onetom> Herkamire: sure it can!
12:03:41 <onetom> Herkamire: under bochs? well, dunno, havent tried it yet
12:08:15 <Herkamire> hey gTs2 
12:08:21 <gTs2> hey
12:19:25 <onetom> Herkamire: imean: havent tried it w the latest version yet
12:31:54 <Herkamire> onetom: but the last one worked?
12:34:47 <onetom> the last 1 i tried?
12:34:57 <onetom> cant recall infact...
12:35:10 <onetom> cant remember that was it vmware or bochs...
12:35:19 <onetom> but gonna try soon
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14:39:36 <TheBlueWizard> hiya all
14:39:48 <onetom> hi
14:41:55 <TheBlueWizard> hiya onetom :)
14:48:28 <Robert> Hi there.
14:48:44 <TheBlueWizard> hiya Robert
14:48:54 <TheBlueWizard> pretty quiet for a long while...alas
14:50:17 <Robert> Yeah :-/
14:50:38 <Robert> I'll read my sister a bedtime story and code some Forth...
14:51:44 <onetom> u should code some new bedtime stories & read some forth 2 ur sister ;)
14:51:51 <TheBlueWizard> heh...tell a story about the time before the Bad Empire Era...should give your sis a dose of Reality ;)
15:01:23 <Robert> Heh.
15:01:41 <Robert> Well, I read part of a shortstory by Frederick Forsyth.
15:10:23 <TheBlueWizard> gotta go...bye all!
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16:06:38 <Robert> Hi all.
16:07:25 <Robert> I'm wondering - in block based systems, do you use block names or something? Just remembering the block number of all block when you are loading them seems primitive :)
16:16:34 <onetom> robert...
16:16:51 <onetom> look @ the source of enth 4 example
16:17:07 <Robert> Hm.. can't you just tell me? :)
16:17:14 * Robert doesn't even know what enth is.
16:17:18 * onetom already lookin4it
16:18:25 <onetom>  marker boot 13 load
16:18:25 <onetom> warm kernel wake stop ;
16:18:25 <onetom> screen 7 block read ;
16:18:25 <onetom> 12x22 8 block read ;
16:18:25 <onetom> 6x11 9 block read ;
16:18:28 <onetom> disk1 1440 blocks ;
16:18:30 <onetom> floppy@ 1  18 block read ;
16:18:33 <onetom> floppy! 0  18 block read ;
16:18:35 <onetom> l block ed 11 block read ;
16:18:38 <onetom> when 17 block read ;
16:18:40 <onetom> mem 16 block read ;
16:18:43 <onetom> flux1 disk1 10000 + ;
16:18:45 <onetom> save 20000  flux1  8000 move disk1 floppy! ;
16:18:48 <onetom> revert flux1 400 +  20400  7f00 move ;
16:18:51 <onetom> dump 10 block read ;
16:18:53 <onetom> words 15 block read ;
16:18:55 <onetom> tetris 20 block read ;
16:18:58 <onetom> bye 3 block read ;
16:19:13 <Robert> Hmmm.
16:20:06 <Robert> I don't really get this, sorry.
16:20:22 <Robert> If you call "tetris", will it read block 20?
17:00:34 <onetom> yes
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22:16:46 <Serg_Penguin> hey !
22:18:49 <Serg_Penguin> does one know i440r's email ?
22:19:14 <Serg_Penguin> dunno want re-download entire IsFort just to find it
22:53:19 <iusris> one sec
22:54:07 <iusris> i440r@mailcity.com
22:57:33 --- nick: iusris -> iusrisleep
22:58:12 <Serg_Penguin> mega tnx
22:58:25 <Serg_Penguin> but pleaze, mungle addresses !!!
22:58:36 <Serg_Penguin> he'll damn u 4r spam .....
22:59:45 * Serg_Penguin just sent 4 abuses...
22:59:52 <Serg_Penguin> oops, 8 abuses
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23:05:20 * fridge boggles
23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/02.12.14