00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.09.28
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05:14:03 <Speuler> moin moin
05:17:53 <onetom> mornin
05:23:56 <Robert> Hello :)
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09:03:56 <TheBlueWizard> hiya all
09:13:55 <TheBlueWizard> bye
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09:15:42 * sillyme eats clog for breakfast
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14:06:43 <TheBlueWizard> hiya all again
14:07:45 <onetom> sleepy days...
14:08:00 <TheBlueWizard> hehe
14:08:18 <TheBlueWizard> too much work?
14:10:19 <onetom> so2say
14:10:45 <onetom> but infact, im not in the mood of doing anything :)
14:11:09 <TheBlueWizard> I do understand that! :)
14:12:14 <onetom> oh, thank u :) but how about u?
14:12:42 <onetom> r u in the same mood now?
14:13:57 <TheBlueWizard> me...today, my friend asked me to help him fix his computer with "modem problems"...turned out he doesn't have a modem, instead, he has an integrated Ethernet port on his 'puter, so I had to explain the difference between these, plus DSL, cable modem, etc. thrown for good measure :)
14:16:18 <onetom> :)))
14:16:53 <onetom> so u played a fater/teacher role 2day
14:18:23 <TheBlueWizard> lol...though I don't play the father role, just a "look, see this jack got 4 grooves, while this one there got 8!  See?  Also this is 'bigger' than that jack...see?" thing
14:25:42 <onetom> loll
14:52:43 <Robert> Good evening.
14:52:53 * Robert silently enters.
14:55:00 <TheBlueWizard> hiya Robert
14:56:00 <Robert> :)
14:56:18 <Robert> My Forth in Forth is getting along fine, except for a little problem with does>
14:56:56 <TheBlueWizard> ah...what problem is that?
14:56:58 * Robert can't figure out a good way to make the high-level definition after does> access the body address of the newly created word.
14:57:19 <Robert> : x create does> . ;
14:57:21 <Robert> x y
14:57:26 <Robert> 5 y
14:57:30 <Robert> That would output 5.
14:57:40 <Robert> Instead of the body address of y.
14:57:57 <XeF4> how is y defined?
14:58:02 <XeF4> ah
14:58:03 <XeF4> nm :)
14:58:07 <TheBlueWizard> ah...the does> needs to push the PFA of y on the stack, then it would work
14:58:59 <Robert> Yes...
14:59:01 <XeF4> that would output the body address of y.
14:59:02 <Robert> Well, I'll try harder.
14:59:09 <XeF4> : x create , does> @ . ;
14:59:15 <Robert> XeF4: Not in my Forth! >:)
15:02:21 <TheBlueWizard> it'd help to outline what each step of does> is doing and what it is supposed to do, in details.  for example, it is supposed to leave the PFA of the created word on stack
15:03:10 <Robert> Mark explained the details of does> yesterday.
15:03:29 <TheBlueWizard> hmm...lemme look at the log then
15:03:37 <Robert> I had to change a few things, now only one problem is there to solve ;)
15:25:43 * TheBlueWizard is now studying does>
15:26:32 * Robert is going crazy.
15:30:11 <TheBlueWizard> lol...I am grokking the logic and I will help you with DOES>
15:30:32 <TheBlueWizard> wait a few minutes while I visualize the whole shebang
15:30:44 <Robert> Well, I know how it works.
15:30:55 <Robert> Just trying to implement it on my fucked up Forth :)
15:36:02 <Robert> : constant create , does> @ ; 
15:36:02 <Robert> 4 constant a 
15:36:02 <Robert> a . 4 
15:36:04 <Robert> Wohoo!
15:36:06 <Robert> I made it :)
15:36:12 <Robert> Ugly as hell, but I made it.
15:36:29 * Robert loves himself for a short while.
15:36:40 <TheBlueWizard> you sure of that?
15:37:02 <Robert> Loving myself or that the thing is working?
15:38:01 <Robert> Hmm... this is bad. When I exit my Forth, there's some data on IsForth's parameter stack.
15:39:25 <Robert> And, heh... How the hell am I supposed to find the error? :-)
15:40:08 <TheBlueWizard> hehe...DOES> logic is indeed maddening....
15:42:40 <TheBlueWizard> ok I got it
15:44:15 <Robert> My does> works in a pretty strange way, but at least it works.
15:44:24 <Robert> Now I have to find that other bug :-/
15:44:55 <TheBlueWizard> let's see how I describe this...there are two parts to DOES>... the first part replaces the first word in the code body of the latest entry in the CURRENT vocabulary with the top return stack word
15:45:38 <TheBlueWizard> that is encoded like this:     : DOES> R> LATEST PFA ! ;CODE .... ;
15:48:52 <TheBlueWizard> thus in the "constant" example, the CFA of "a" would point to the ;CODE portion in DOES>.
15:51:00 <TheBlueWizard> lemme check my thought hehe
15:55:17 <Robert> Hmmm
15:55:18 <Robert> create name-key ," key"
15:55:18 <Robert>  : [w-key] ( -- ascii )
15:55:18 <Robert>   key ppush ;
15:55:30 <Robert> Why is this pusing a word at compile-time?
15:56:32 <Robert> : [w-key] ( -- ascii )
15:56:32 <Robert>   key ppush ;
15:56:39 <Robert> That's the code that does it.
15:57:06 <Robert> KEY shouldn't do that, right?
15:57:18 <Robert> And I can't imagine ppush does, it doesn't do it anywhere else.
15:59:02 <TheBlueWizard> what does ppush does?
15:59:19 <Robert> : ppush ( n1 -- )
15:59:19 <Robert>   pptr cell- dup !> pptr ! ;
15:59:26 <Robert> It doesn't behave strange anywhere else.
16:01:07 <Robert> What the fuck?
16:01:41 <Robert> If I change the definition to an empty one, the pushing of that mysterious number is moved down the file, a few definitions.
16:01:44 <Robert> Something is WRONG.
16:04:42 <XeF4> pptr is TOS pointer?
16:04:50 <Robert> Yes.
16:05:00 <Robert> Hmm.. I'll just ignore this for now.
16:05:46 <XeF4> wth is !>
16:06:37 <Robert> Never used IsForth? :-)
16:06:52 <Robert> It's used to store into values (called vars in isforth).
16:06:56 <Robert> 0 var x
16:06:59 <Robert> 5 !> x
16:08:40 <XeF4> : ppop ( -- n ) pptr dup @ cell+ !> pptr ; 
16:09:12 <Robert> : ppop ( -- n1 )
16:09:12 <Robert>   pptr dup cell+ !> pptr @ ;
16:09:13 <XeF4> ack @ swap 
16:09:14 <Robert> :-)
16:09:20 * TheBlueWizard checks out UNIFORTH, and found out DOES> is implemented differently....aaargh!
16:09:36 <XeF4> there lies the problem
16:09:42 <Robert> XeF4: Hm?
16:09:58 <XeF4> er.. no it doesn't , sorry, I shifted my sleep schedule by 10hrs in 1 day
16:10:23 <Robert> XeF4: Cool. That makes your brain clear, right?
16:10:25 <TheBlueWizard> the DOES> puts a (;CODE) into the defining code....hmm!
16:11:50 <TheBlueWizard> I think there are several different implementations of DOES>....confusing, yes?   but I do know that PFA of the created words must be there at the very end so that the code following DOES> can use it...
16:13:03 <Robert> : [w-does>] ( -- )
16:13:03 <Robert>   w-dodoes dptr cell+ d-, ;
16:13:03 <Robert> name-does>          flag-immediate  ' [w-does>]      d-low: w-;
16:13:11 <Robert> : [w-dodoes] ( -- )
16:13:12 <Robert>   iptr dup cell+ !> iptr   @ last header.does nip !   ['] [w-[dodoes]] last header.pointer nip !   [w-exit] ;
16:13:17 <Robert> : [w-[dodoes]] ( -- a1 )
16:13:18 <Robert>   iptr rpush   w header.does nip @ !> iptr   w header + ppush ;
16:13:34 <Robert> Looks confusing, but it's just very unclean. :-)
16:14:22 * TheBlueWizard 's eyes glaze over then fall off, roll around on the floor, and get eaten by grue ;)
16:14:40 * Robert claps his hands.
16:14:59 <Robert> Forth is wonderful.
16:15:12 * TheBlueWizard fetches another pair of eyes from his satchel, and puts them into his sockets
16:16:30 <Klaw> i am wonderful
16:16:50 <Robert> Klaw: We know, dear.
16:17:09 <TheBlueWizard> Klaw: were you trying to get on here a while ago?
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16:17:20 <TheBlueWizard> hiya Herkamire
16:17:26 <Herkamire> hi :)
16:18:15 <Robert> Hi Herkamire :)
16:18:39 <Herkamire> hihi ;)
16:18:45 <Klaw> TheBlueWizard: by "get on" you mean..
16:19:17 <Herkamire> I'm adding network support to fpos (through linux syscalls)
16:20:19 <TheBlueWizard> Robert: by the way, I read the clog's log of forth for last nite and it appears Mark gaves maybe only half of the description of DOES>...is that about right to you?
16:20:53 <Robert> Ehm...
16:21:04 <Robert> I think his description was quite complete.
16:21:23 <Robert> After all, even I was able to implement does> :-)
16:21:33 <Robert> (After his lesson)
16:22:56 <Robert> : constant create , does> @ ; 
16:22:56 <Robert> : variable create 4 allot does> ; 
16:23:05 <Robert> My Forth now can do fancy things like that :)
16:23:23 <Robert> For minimum efficency, it's written in 100% Forth.
16:23:32 <TheBlueWizard> I see...OK
16:23:48 <Robert> ;)
16:24:32 <TheBlueWizard> erm...the variable should allot a single cell...methink the "4 allot" idiom might be apropos for ARRAY coding
16:26:36 <Robert> Yes-
16:26:49 <Robert> Would "0 ," have been better there?
16:27:40 <TheBlueWizard> mmhmm...that is a traditional way to code VARIABLE routine
16:36:56 --- nick: Starving -> Speuler
16:39:07 <Robert> Speuler :)
16:39:28 <TheBlueWizard> hiya Speuler
17:00:12 <TheBlueWizard> gotta go...bye!
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18:42:50 <Speuler> oh
18:42:54 <Speuler> hi too
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19:40:34 <TheBlueWizard> hiya all
19:41:46 <TheBlueWizard> Robert: I found the material on DOES>, so I can explain it in excruciating details :)
19:41:59 <TheBlueWizard> if you are still awake, that is :)
19:47:40 * TheBlueWizard decides Robert is asleep
19:51:33 <TheBlueWizard> bye all
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20:45:44 <Herkamire> I got socket support working in fpos :)
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22:24:22 <air> Herkamire: fpos?
23:10:49 <Herkamire> fpos is tathi's native PPC colorforth
23:11:58 <Herkamire> it currently runs under ppc linux.
23:12:41 <Herkamire> after we write an editor, tathi is going to make it boot
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23:48:09 * Xuz waves
23:49:49 <Herkamire> yo
23:50:08 <Xuz> How're y'all?
23:51:41 <Herkamire> I am well, though I should go to bed
23:53:13 <Xuz> Sleep is for the week, and it's a Saturday/Sunday!
23:53:42 <Herkamire> I get weak when I don't sleep ;)
23:53:58 <Herkamire> actually... I get weak after come to think of it :) ;)
23:54:03 * Xuz should sleep.  He's drinking beer and programming instead :)
23:54:23 <Herkamire> yay programming :)
23:54:30 <Herkamire> whatcha programming?
23:54:57 <Xuz> Making slightly more functional versions of Perl's uberliscious string-handling functions for Scheme.
23:55:00 <Herkamire> I just dug up an old project to make a jabber client that works in the text terminal
23:55:03 <Xuz> Yes, I know, it should be Forth if I'm mentioning it here.
23:55:15 <Xuz> I think EVERYONE has an old project to make a text Jabber client, I know I do.
23:55:27 <Herkamire> hehe :)
23:55:44 <Herkamire> I was suprised to find that the code in mine doesn't look bad :)
23:55:56 <Xuz> I never finished mine.  I was going to model the interface after MH.
23:55:57 <Herkamire> it's got error handling and everything ;)
23:55:59 <Xuz> For while MH isn't the best interface for MAIL.
23:56:04 <Xuz> (Since it doesn't work with threading)
23:56:10 <Xuz> It seems like it would be a WONDERFUL interface for IM.
23:56:19 <Herkamire> have you used irssi?
23:56:26 * Xuz merfs.  This "high gravity lager" hits harder than he was expecting.
23:56:31 <Xuz> Nope, what's that?
23:56:42 <Herkamire> CLI irc client
23:57:07 <Herkamire> great program :)
23:57:13 <air> cria is better :)
23:57:27 <Herkamire> air: better how?
23:57:40 * Herkamire tries to think if there was anything he wished irssi would do
23:57:43 <air> cuz i wrote it
23:57:51 <Herkamire> ahh :)
23:57:59 <Xuz> Right now I'm just using BitchX.  I used to use Epic4 but the DCC wasn't as good.
23:58:00 <air> and cria looks nicer out of the box
23:58:09 * Xuz laughs
23:59:31 <Herkamire> If I could get myself to write an interface with seperate scrolling "windows" (like irssi, or like tabs in a browser)
23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/02.09.28