00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.09.24 00:03:59 --- quit: yeahright (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00:09:22 --- quit: skylan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01:05:00 --- join: proteus (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 01:06:13 --- quit: proteusguy (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02:04:49 --- quit: proteus (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02:05:06 --- join: proteus (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 02:09:44 --- quit: onetom_ ("leaving") 02:09:52 --- join: onetom (~tom@novtan.bio.u-szeged.hu) joined #forth 02:45:49 --- quit: proteus (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02:47:15 --- join: proteus (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 04:05:08 --- join: yeahright (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 04:05:40 --- quit: proteus (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04:22:58 --- join: cleverdra (julianf@0-1pool37-238.nas2.florence1.sc.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 05:04:22 --- quit: yeahright (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 05:04:48 --- join: yeahright (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 05:12:50 --- join: rot13 (~bbbbb@CPE-144-137-78-176.nsw.bigpond.net.au) joined #forth 05:29:33 --- join: Serg_Penguin (~Z@nat-ch1.nat.comex.ru) joined #forth 05:29:42 hi 05:29:49 --- join: LuckyPhil (~phowlett@CPE-203-45-248-201.qld.bigpond.net.au) joined #forth 05:30:56 hi LuckyPhil 05:31:04 Hello 05:33:01 sorry work hard... 05:33:16 what u working on? 05:33:47 trying to make 5 computers out of glitching trash... 05:34:00 sounds like fun 05:34:23 --- part: rot13 left #forth 05:42:14 sounds like rotten crap out of rotary cannon.... 05:45:50 I've heard that. The smell is *awful* 05:46:40 What is the intended market for these computers? 05:50:17 surely the ones who are too poor for good one 05:50:50 i would buy weaker but reliable comp 05:51:00 * cleverdra nods. 05:51:12 Gaming systems, then? 05:53:14 damn, even servers and routers ! 05:54:11 Well, I hope at least the CPU/RAM/Disk isn't glitching trash on those. 05:55:33 Oh, and the Motherboard, power supply. /me hums. 05:55:48 Olivetti 90 - mboard is worth asus one, and i never seen trash Intel CPU 05:56:02 mostly ram and hdd are source of failure 05:56:12 ah, OK. 05:56:37 So, do you get sent whole computers in which just the disk has failed? 05:57:07 but now we are testing Intel 820CC m/boards w/ Celeron 1000 on soldered-up Slot1->PGA adapter 06:00:01 of >1000 olivetti <100 were failed 06:01:22 at first glance, i did'nt count 06:03:24 just a _few_ mboards were bad - mostly mechanical damage 06:03:41 --- quit: yeahright (Connection timed out) 06:04:09 HDD controllers - hot plugged ? 06:04:21 --- join: yeahright (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 06:05:19 --- join: tathi (~josh@ip68-9-68-50.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 06:06:37 hi tathi 06:07:17 hi tathi 06:07:21 hey hey 06:08:08 LuckyPhil: you new? 06:11:06 yep. I'm a newbie 06:13:25 so how'd you find out about forth? 06:14:07 a friend showed it to me 06:14:28 facinating language.. the concept is so simple.. its scary! :) 06:15:33 did u read Leo Broudie "Starting Forth" and "Thinking Forth" ? 06:15:46 these books are a MUST READ ! 06:15:58 here in RU - translated by some amateur 06:16:13 first - even published at Soviet time 06:16:23 No, hard books to come by from what I have read already 06:16:54 they are thery easy reading, and inspire wery deep ideas 06:17:08 and what have u read ? 06:17:19 ERR thery=wery 06:17:21 * cleverdra found "Starting Forth" in a thriftshop. 06:17:35 thrift ? 06:17:51 no books, only what I have found on the net. 06:18:29 I'm currently "playing" with Enth/Flux 06:18:36 net is great trash can, if u aren't search expert.... 06:19:02 um, a place where people donate clothes/furniture/books/ornaments &c and where other people buy them very cheaply -- for instance, 0.05 USD for "Starting Forth". This is a college town, so this thriftshop is overflowing with books. 06:19:35 O-o-ops.. mega cool 06:19:39 ah, Enth/Flux. Great system. I can't use 3?? and post- versions. 06:20:08 I'm in AU, so finding the book might be harder 06:20:20 i now look for expert, not net-trash, texts on pencil-and-paper crypto 06:20:23 Enth 040 is much better to use than 3 06:20:42 enth url please ? 06:21:10 Enth -> http://www.ynet.com.au/sean/index.html 06:21:23 I haven't tried 040, but the time of my interest has passed. Even had I spare monitor... 06:21:35 i sucked both books out of wire, in RU, have no paper ones... 06:21:43 I'm lucky enough to have a spare laptop which Enth040 runs very nicely on 06:21:53 LuckyPhil - you may find my PC Speaker driver somewhere :-/ 06:22:36 cleverdra - Is that the one on the sleepless nights wiki? 06:22:54 LuckyPhil - yes. 06:24:07 Enth040 is very much flux now 06:24:56 how much KB is Flux ? 06:25:07 don't know. 06:25:43 192k image that gets transfered to a floppy 06:26:52 actually, the driver was written in Flux. The Enth is a translation. I don't suppose it matters much in code that simple, though. 06:27:13 What do you mean, it's very much flux? 06:27:36 flux is a "colorforth" written on top of Enth 06:27:45 that's what I've worked out so far 06:28:09 enth is standalone ? is it real- or prot- mode ? 06:28:16 Yes, I know that. Do you mean that more of the system is written Flux-side? 06:28:29 Serg - standalone, and IIRC protected-mode. 06:28:43 yes, protected mode 06:28:54 a 'native' Forth, we call it, not to be confused with a 'native-code' Forth, which Enth/Flux is also. 06:28:55 there is only the colorEd now, 06:29:24 but it is so much more... sexy in the way you edit and browse code.. 06:29:39 ah, so Enth is just a bootstrap. No great loss. 06:29:53 even a dumbo newbie like me can browse and make out stuff on what it is doing. 06:29:56 LuckyPhil - have you played much with the multitasker, yet? 06:30:42 cleverdra - No, the only thing i've done is create a disk block, and read/write floppy disk blocks 06:30:46 (or does Enth/Flux now multitask on floppy disk i/o, removing that incentive?) 06:31:37 floppy disk access is definately background scheduled 06:32:04 enth boots up straight away, with block 0.. and the other blocks load up in real time as the data is read. That is what I have seen 06:32:19 Oh, I think that in .3 06:33:04 I'm just trying to understand the colors now, I used to play with just the "enth" part. 06:33:22 the colors are different to Chucks 06:33:33 erm, Enth will have to read more than block 0 to boot up at all. Enth .2 read the first 180 or so blocks on boot, IIRC. 06:33:34 i downloaded it, does it have good docs inside ? 06:33:52 Serg - not very good docs inside it, but OK docs outside it. 06:34:00 err, at least for .2 06:34:02 url ? 06:34:16 only brief readme near ZIP.... 06:34:31 They're on the URL LuckyPhil gave you and inside the zip. 06:34:47 floppy.txt, etc. no? 06:35:15 actually cleverdra, alot of the docs aren't in the new release, just the readme.txt file 06:37:15 Odd, OK. 06:37:53 alot of the stuff has been tidy'd up in to the readme file. Sean also is putting some docs/thoughts on his www page too 06:37:58 just tonight actually 06:43:41 still trying to work out the meaning of the colors though.. esp the difference between compile (green) and execute (white) 06:44:57 does he have Chuck's two-dictionary thing? 06:46:00 tathi - yes. 06:46:11 no idea.. I'm still learning 06:46:21 specifically, he has Chuck's (ancient) vocabulary-for-immediate-words. 06:46:55 which was present in cmForth. 06:47:17 cool 06:48:12 It's useful =) I think that it's not very popular, though, because it doesn't quite work with a programming style that involves many vocabularies. 06:48:27 didn't know it had been around that long 06:48:42 only about a year 06:49:12 more importantly.. it has tetris. :) 06:49:13 I've recently switched to doing my dictionaries that way and really liking it 06:49:14 tathi - LuckyPhil is referring to Enth/Flux. 06:49:27 cleverdra - yeah, I got that 06:50:01 tathi - good =) I addressed that to you because I didn't want to repeat myself in addressing it to LuckyPhil. 06:51:11 I can see how it would be a bit of a nuisance with vocabularies, but I tend to just start a new copy of the interpreter for each "application", so... 06:52:19 * cleverdra nods. 07:00:31 Its getting late.. enough forth for one night.. thanks for the help. :).. might be on tomorrow. :) 07:03:42 --- quit: yeahright (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07:03:56 --- part: LuckyPhil left #forth 07:04:18 --- join: yeahright (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 07:08:43 --- quit: Serg_Penguin (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 07:26:55 --- join: Herkamire (~jason@wsip68-15-54-54.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 08:04:22 --- quit: yeahright (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08:04:26 --- join: proteus (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 09:04:23 --- quit: proteus (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09:04:56 --- join: proteus (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 09:12:08 --- join: I440r (~mark4@1Cust103.tnt2.bloomington.in.da.uu.net) joined #forth 09:12:33 Hey. 09:12:35 man this channel is starting to become cool :) 09:12:39 except for robert :) 09:12:43 Bah! 09:12:46 heh 09:13:28 whussup :) 09:16:55 got any new code written in isforth ? 09:18:49 re 09:18:51 --- join: spoob (~steve@ppp-160.cust203-87-123.ghr.chariot.net.au) joined #forth 09:18:53 wish i could run it 09:19:02 spoob :) 09:19:05 misfire 09:19:48 damn 09:20:37 hi spoob 09:20:40 u a forth coder ?? 09:20:58 Hiya... I did Forth a long time ago but I never stopped loving it 09:21:00 ianni you wish you could run what... isforth ? 09:21:09 spoob then you belong in here :) 09:21:43 i love forth more and more every day and every day i hate c equally more :) 09:22:06 spoob a linux user ??? 09:22:20 you should grab my forth compiler at isforth.clss.net :))) 09:22:21 heh 09:22:23 Linux for the last 10 years, just switched to OS X 09:22:31 09:22:36 :) 09:22:38 ouch 09:22:43 written in assembler too. nice :) 09:22:51 ya 09:22:52 are you doing any colorforth? 09:23:01 no, ive not even looked at colorforth 09:23:15 tho i prolly shud 09:23:20 I've been on the colorforth mailing list for the last year or so, waiting for something to happen. 09:23:31 there was a cryptic message from chuck about 4 months ago saying he's about to wak eup 09:23:35 well chuck just sold his house and moved 09:24:05 maybe thats "wake up and smell the coffee, nobody is ever going to be interested in forth so i shiould quit" 09:24:08 i hope not 09:24:22 he has been in here a cpl of times btw 09:24:31 and jeff fox is a semi regular here too 09:24:45 so this channel is the right place :) 09:25:11 heh chuck hasnt been in for a while but when he settles into his new home he migh tdrop by every now and then 09:25:47 he did an online q/a session in here, you can find the logs of it on jeffs page 09:25:52 jef's 09:25:53 grr 09:25:55 ianni: does spoob is ur friend? 09:25:58 i cant spellz 09:26:50 onetom; just met, but I mentioned Forth in #macdev so he invited me in 09:27:02 ah, c :) 09:27:13 spoob: tathi is making a native PPC colorforth, which I am working with 09:27:20 hehe i started teh channel when i started with isforth 09:27:29 spoob: it currently only runs under linux though 09:27:31 back then i knew NOTHING about linux asm coding hehe 09:27:34 spoob: and #squeak is also a great channel 09:27:39 and i was the only one in here for ages :) 09:27:55 * I440r slaps onetom arround with the isforth manual 09:28:00 oopts there is no isforth manual! 09:28:02 doh! 09:28:09 spoob: they r more highlevel, but have a lot of common goals w 4th i think 09:28:17 I440r: loll 09:28:26 is squeek part of the tunes project ? 09:28:35 the ppl in #tunes are always talking squeek 09:28:37 gotta go now, but bbl 09:29:00 I440r: havent u tried squeak yet!?!? u should 09:29:02 I440r: I don't think so. it may be a simular aim tohugh 09:29:33 ive just mentioned it because spoob refered 2 os x 09:29:37 herkamire; sounds interesting. I'd certainly give it a try since I've been waiting on th colourforth mailing list for something to happen 09:29:45 it should run on top of it 2 09:29:57 but chuck seems kinda dead. he only posts every couple of months 09:30:03 spoob dont give up on chuck yet tho :) 09:30:27 when i win the lottery im gona give chuck a million or two... hrm... i wonder if i should buy a ticket 09:30:38 spoob: i think jeffs gonna b his main follower 09:30:58 I440r: the lottery is the "stupid person tax" 09:31:05 and after then... who knows... probably we r.. 09:31:19 if you're stupid, you have to pay 1-5 dollers per day. 09:31:22 bfn 09:31:25 Herkamire lol - i dont do the lottery but if i did and won i would be donating to chucks cause 09:31:44 I440r: I might do the same 09:31:52 I wouldn't give up on Chuck... I'm just amazed that I'm actually reading messages typed by the total legend who wrapped my brain around a brick and smashed it into pieces so lon ago 09:32:04 hehe 09:32:27 I wish Chuck would write a book on how to program, because the few tips Ive seen from him have really been good 09:32:27 spoob im not one to suffer from "hero worship" but with chuck.... 09:32:29 it sounds like there is a financial interest in chucks now (25x) chip 09:32:44 so hopefully he's working on getting that into production 09:33:00 i440r; yep, same. I was one of the first 100 linux users, but i've never emailed Linus. I just don't care, but Chuck's different 09:33:38 there's gotta be a page where someone has collected a bunch of good advice that has come out of chuck 09:33:52 spoob ive emailed linus, i sent my parody of his "coding style" doc to him, he didnt like it hehe 09:34:07 ftp://67.241.42.103/pub 09:34:10 its in there somewhere hehe 09:34:17 maybe i shud send it to /. 09:34:36 :) 09:35:01 spoob: currently our ppc forth (fpos) runs under ppc linux. it's written in asm. (2K core, and the rest in colorforth). 09:35:08 u should have seen the flames i got when i posted it to the kernel mailing list heheh 09:35:38 Herk; why would anyone with apple hardware run Linux though? 09:36:00 apple hardware's not really good enough so it's only OS X that makes an apple worth getting? 09:36:10 (I'm a recent Mac convert) 09:36:13 spoob: it's not ready for the word by any means, but if you want to check it out, I think you can get it at: http://qualdan.homeip.net:5000/svn/fpos/trunk/ 09:36:38 spoob: apple hardware is excelent 09:36:55 herk; what is colorforth like to program in? 09:36:55 spoob why did you convert to mac? 09:37:05 arent mac's more expensive than intel ? 09:37:06 i440r; the documentation. 09:37:27 spoob: I haven't done much. but it's cool so far 09:37:29 loads and loads of programmer documentation written in a professional, clear and consistent style across the whole system 09:37:50 I would still buy a Mac just for the documentation even if it was half the speed of an Intel 09:38:25 spoob: fpos will be an OS. for now it runs on our current OS (ppc linux). 09:38:26 i440r; found the coding style file 09:38:58 herk; I'll be sure to hang out here, and I'd definitely be one of the testers when you get it to own OS stage :) 09:39:33 spoob: cool :) well this is the place to be 09:39:44 spoob let me know what you think heh 09:40:02 it was done as humor but it also points out some of the things i realy hate about c coders 09:42:08 i440r; most of the problems you point out are from bad coding in the first place, so the faults would still be there in any language 09:42:25 spoob i know but c encourages them 09:42:32 simply because there are so many c coders 09:42:42 and 99% of the crap they produce is BAD EXAMPLE code 09:42:50 any idiot and is brother code c 09:42:53 can code c 09:42:56 It's certainly a problem trying to find a project which has code that is good enough for you to go "ok, this is something to learn from" 09:43:21 exactly 09:43:28 and that includes teh linux kernel sources 09:43:38 i consider the linux kernel to be CLOSED source 09:43:41 I440r - any idiot and his brother can code Forth. 09:43:51 simply because its so fucking complex! 09:44:10 cleverdra i dont think so, the initial learning curve tends to weed out the true lamers 09:44:21 they take one look at RPN and go screaming for mamma 09:44:37 chuck's idea is that an OS is completely unneccessary and his 25x forth chip solves that problem simply by having a CPU per process without having to contend for resources 09:44:37 few get past that initial fear of simple logic 09:45:28 microsoft wouldnt like the 25x then :) 09:45:43 I sometimes muse about setting up a web site for interviewing people, except instead of me (unknown nobody) interviewing Linus, I would set up interviews between two interesting people... eg, Chuck vs Linus 09:46:13 Matz vs Wall 09:46:20 matz ? 09:46:27 Ruby guy 09:46:37 i think larry wall is very clever but he has featureitis 09:46:55 My languages are assembler, C, forth and Ruby 09:47:11 I haven't used forth for a long time, but that's how I view myself 09:47:12 i code (in this order) assembler, forth, c 09:47:40 I'm playing with Objective C for OS X, and I quite like it... but then it's based on Smalltalk which Ruby is too 09:47:43 i only learned c because it pays the bills 09:47:52 cept ive not had a job in over a year now 09:47:53 dammit! 09:49:03 I've never learned Perl. Just not my thing. I want complete understanding of all my tools, so the approach of only using what I need makes me feel like I'm wasting my time coding something when there's probably a single line I dont know that would do the same thing 09:50:04 so I end up spending all my time searching for that single line. But Ruby's based on a few simple and repeated concepts to end up with Perl's power without Perl's overhead 09:50:12 for x in *.tar.tar; do mv $x `basename $x .tar`.gz; done # perl -e 'for (<*.tar.tar>) { rename $_, basename($_).'.gz' }' 09:50:37 That looks... nice. 09:50:48 perl -e 'rename $_, basename($_).'.gz' for <*.tar.tar>' # too 09:50:56 i never learned any of that shit, perl, ruby, BASH!!! 09:51:04 i seriously cant be bothered with any of it 09:51:22 i see absolutely no reason to learn anything after having learned asm and forth 09:51:36 i wouldnt even have bothered with c except my boss told me i had to :P 09:51:52 Dir.match(".tar.tar").each{|f| Dir.rename f, Dir.basename(f, ".tar")+".gz" } # ruby =) 09:52:02 I440r: You're a true fanatic :) 09:52:22 i440r; forth lets you enter more code at any stage so you can script things or plug in or extend. C can't, so you have to work around that with a scripting language if you want to write anything real 09:52:28 BTW, I dropped the ".tar" argument in Perl's basename(), unless it defaultly snips \..*$ 09:52:32 so I would suggest looking at Ruby 09:52:58 Also, that ruby is really pseudoruby; I forget what the exact basename/rename/globbing methods are named. 09:53:15 clever; yeah, same here which is why I didn't contribute a Ruby version :) 09:53:37 spoob where u located ? 09:53:42 South Australia 09:53:51 cool! the chix in australia are HOT!!! 09:54:35 some of them 09:54:39 :) 09:54:53 I'd say about 5% of the total female population in australia are hot 09:55:02 And the rest? 09:55:13 50+ or just geeks? 09:55:35 geeks can be hot, too. 09:55:35 * Robert thinks geeks should own the world. 09:55:37 50+, average, fat, not that great, the normal run of humanity 09:55:53 bah. *most* females are hot, 09:55:59 cleverdra: In theory, yes. 09:56:04 Robert - in my experience. 09:56:16 cleverdra: Many geeks became geeks for a reason. 09:56:36 beautiful chicks learn early in life they can get what they want by wiggling their puppies so there's not much incentive for them to bother being geeks 09:56:37 (!) 09:56:40 Well, at least attractive. 'hot' should probably be reserved for the upper echelon of attractiveness, however fuzzy that is. 09:56:55 spoob: Er... something like that, yeah. 09:57:09 if I were a chick, I'd rather be humping hot latino studs in madonna's limosuine than struggling with Scheme 09:57:22 lol 09:57:22 spoob: Really? 09:57:28 Robert - there must be more to it than that. I, male though I be, am surely very attractive =) 09:57:31 what have i started! 09:57:43 cleverdra: Are you a Real Geek then? 09:58:28 Robert - I have an HP49G. 09:58:33 cleverdra: The better you look - the less geek you are. That's what I can tell from my experience. 09:58:42 And that is..? Calculator? :) 09:58:58 oh yes. 09:59:02 a RPN calculator. :) 09:59:20 --- join: skylan (sjh@207.164.213.39) joined #forth 09:59:24 Does that make him a Real Geek? 09:59:28 * Robert doubts. 09:59:33 yes :) 09:59:45 It's a symbolic math machine with an assembler, SysRPL (very forthlike), UserRPL (less so, a blend of lisp and Forth), and BasicRPL (hideous alternative syntax for UserRPL). 09:59:48 i always wanted one of those 09:59:54 only a true geek would have an RPN calculator. Even the Woz had one 10:00:03 A geek should (1) be scared to death of the opposite gender, except on IRC. (2) ugly. 10:00:15 the woz ? 10:00:24 Robert; or have a handicap of some kind. I'm deaf, for example : 10:00:24 :) 10:00:25 It *looks* like a simple calculator, yes; people unfamaliar with it have assumed that it is a TI of some kind. 10:00:34 spoob: Oh, like TBW :) 10:00:38 i440r; oh boy, have you got some history to catch up on. :) 10:00:39 yea 10:00:44 tbw is deaf too 10:00:47 Robert - I adore the opposite gender, but I'm shy. Does that count? 10:00:55 i440r; the Woz, Steve Wozniak. The guy who created the Apple ][ 10:00:57 cleverdra: Err... sure. 10:01:04 cleverdra: Shy means being scared :) 10:01:08 spoob history has the relation to truth that theology has to religeon. i.e. none to speak of 10:01:16 i ws a c64 man myself 10:01:22 Robert - 'shy' is a better word =) 10:01:39 cleverdra: Sure. But in the end, it's the same. 10:01:55 * Robert knows few non-geeks on OPN. 10:02:02 i440r; steve wozniak is the same kind of guy as chuck 10:02:03 (s/OPN/Freenode/) 10:02:12 spoob: In what way? 10:02:12 * cleverdra is horribly shy, on the level of Scott Adams, apparently, through one of the annotated Dilbert books. 10:02:12 heh cool 10:02:18 spoob: Fanatic? :)) 10:02:48 robert; popping a pimple momentarily reveals steel and computers humming away below their surface :) 10:03:12 Wirth has also been reasonably compared to Chuck; google clf 10:03:31 ugh pascal is crap 10:03:34 I wouldn't agree when it comes to Wirth. :) 10:03:37 spoob: Haha :) 10:03:38 not as bad as c but still crap 10:03:47 nickle's worth 10:04:01 I440r: How about Modula? >:) 10:04:17 whats modula ??? :) 10:04:18 --- quit: proteus (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10:04:25 spoob - you're basing that on emotion evaluation of community percepts of Wirth, not any reason about their respective histories. 10:04:28 I440r: Bleh. 10:04:34 on an emotional 10:04:40 wirth and djykstra and knuth are all academic ivory tower white knuckled wankers imnsho. wozniak and chuck actually worked with the real shit 10:04:47 --- join: proteus (~proteusgu@24-197-147-197.charterga.net) joined #forth 10:04:50 spoob - no, you're wrong. 10:05:01 spoob - you're embarrasingly wrong about Knuth. 10:05:13 Educate me. :) 10:05:22 spoob i almost baught all of knuths algorithm books, then i opened one and read a little 10:05:27 i put it down and walked away shuddering 10:05:32 I don't have any big CS idols yet. Sorry. You sound like little girls discussing Backstreet Boys. :P 10:05:46 Robert =) 10:05:52 Robert; fair cop :) 10:05:56 lol 10:06:16 he's just a kid yet 10:06:20 he will learn 10:06:22 eventually 10:06:27 However, I must admit the inventor of Forth has to get some credit for that :) 10:06:29 I440r: ;) 10:07:29 cleverdra; I don't know what the world thinks of Wirth, but I'm judging based off Pascal and his ideals of static types. 10:08:22 for Knuth; I'm judging based off how he spends all his time writing academic tomes that rival stephen hawking's work as being something that everyone has but nobody reads :) 10:09:43 * cleverdra declines argument. 10:09:51 ah well. worth a try :) 10:16:32 :) 10:16:34 lol 10:16:50 hawking is a fscking genius 10:17:05 but its all useless shit, it is all just theoretical 10:17:12 cant prove any of it 10:17:17 "Useless"? 10:17:30 Einstein's "shit" was also called "useless", heh. 10:17:31 quantum theory. what will it produce for us 10:17:37 * cleverdra sneers. 10:17:42 I440r: Quantum computers? :P 10:17:45 i STILL call it useless, what has THAt produced 10:17:49 other than teh a-bomb :P 10:17:54 Heh. 10:18:05 It explained why Mercury's orbit behaved strange. 10:18:24 And...er...that it's not a good idea to try to reach the speed of light :P 10:18:24 etc. 10:18:33 how is the orbit of mercury strange ? 10:18:38 nuclear power plants :P 10:18:51 DARWIN: Well, this is an interesting theory; it would certainly explain all those birds... but, hey, this is all useless shit anyway -- it's just too theoretical. 10:19:05 heh 10:19:07 Supply your favorite scientist. 10:19:10 I440r: It's so close to the sun that it's affected by some relativistic effects. 10:19:11 cleverdra im not a big believer in darwins theory 10:19:11 Heh. 10:19:13 Right. 10:19:20 I440r: What do you think then? 10:19:21 except the survival of the fitest 10:19:24 I440r - that's because you haven't read his book, and have no clue what his theory is. 10:19:26 creation 10:19:42 I440r: ..? That's why you don't like scientists? :) 10:19:55 Creationism is useless shit -- it's all too theoretical. 10:20:20 robert einstein said that when science reaches the pinacle of its abilities it will find god waiting for him there 10:20:27 or words to that effect 10:20:39 cleverdra: But you have to admit that it's proved in a good way. 10:20:52 Robert - proof by religion? I'll pass =) 10:20:58 cleverdra: ;) 10:21:08 Hrm. 10:21:16 Got to buy some milk. 10:21:19 i dont need proof, you prove anything and someone can come along and disprove it 10:21:20 everything is useless shit unless it's in the right place at the right time 10:21:21 Stores close in ~40 min. 10:21:23 all you need is faith :) 10:21:26 Heh. 10:21:27 Right. 10:21:40 Faith.. 10:21:51 I thought you said "all you need is forth" 10:21:52 So that whatever arguments people come with, you can just scream "NO!"? :) 10:22:01 exactly 10:22:06 thats what i scream at C 10:22:26 spoob: "There's nothing I can code that can't be coded, it's eeasy... ALL YOU NEED IS FORTH" etc. :-) 10:22:40