00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.06.28 00:15:38 --- join: Serg_peng (~snaga_NOI@nat-ch1.nat.comex.ru) joined #forth 00:16:24 Hi :) 00:16:33 hi 00:16:43 look at cryptomancer.chat.ru 00:16:48 IRC server? 00:17:02 Or web page? 00:17:02 my sokoban ;) 00:17:15 look at http://cryptomancer.chat.ru 00:17:36 OK- 00:18:23 i'll have a vacation from next week, so today is last day w/ Net 00:18:39 and i'll not make it look better till August ;) 00:18:54 or till next job w/ inet :( 00:19:32 Ah, nice. 00:19:42 :/ 00:20:07 Poor russians :/ 00:21:06 really, here is very bad nation 00:21:56 parents only feed kids, dunno give a thinking to win in life.... 00:22:02 80-90% 00:22:17 and me fell in this % :( 00:23:43 and i'm begging such thinking from ones who does have, and from books ;( 00:24:03 all hell damn it ! 00:55:59 --- quit: rob_ert ("leaving") 01:00:41 --- quit: Serg_peng ("maybe, boss on the horizon...") 01:04:21 --- join: rob_ert (~robert@h237n2fls31o965.telia.com) joined #forth 04:05:42 --- join: Serg_peng (~snaga_NOI@nat-ch1.nat.comex.ru) joined #forth 04:15:52 --- join: cleverdra (julianf@0-2pool111-5.nas2.florence1.sc.us.da.qwest.net) joined #forth 04:17:25 --- quit: Serg_peng (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04:17:55 --- quit: n_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04:40:26 --- quit: Soap` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06:08:11 --- join: tathi (~josh@wsip68-15-54-54.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 06:29:03 --- quit: skylan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06:54:13 --- join: n_ (aasd@pcp01518417pcs.reding01.pa.comcast.net) joined #forth 06:55:43 --- join: Herkamire (~jason@wsip68-15-54-54.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 08:57:58 --- join: Etaoin (~david@ljk32.sat.net) joined #forth 09:11:13 --- join: dsmith (~dsmith@208.40.56.34) joined #forth 10:30:44 --- quit: cleverdra (Connection timed out) 12:29:17 --- join: XeF4 (ydilcl@12-245-116-85.client.attbi.com) joined #forth 12:42:35 --- join: skylan (sjh@Riverview11.tbaytel.net) joined #forth 12:46:22 * dsmith is away: getting car 12:52:34 I want a monocycle 12:52:54 == unicycle? 12:53:06 Hi Herkamire :) 12:53:10 * XeF4 apologizes profusely.. unicycle = 12:53:14 nah, I have a unicycle :) 12:53:21 what's the difference? 12:53:54 I wast thinking a large wheel with me and a motor inside 12:56:38 A couple years ago I figured out how to build one with a huge intertube 12:57:02 the visibility might be really bad on that though :) 13:01:34 you could put windows around the tube (and get road hypnosis after 100m) 13:05:09 hehe :) 13:07:59 --- join: tcn (tcn@tc2-login16.megatrondata.com) joined #forth 13:17:20 Hi tcn 13:22:53 hey 13:31:33 exciting session here :) 13:32:10 Sure it is. 13:32:39 (Actually, we're discussing IsForth in a place you can't see :) 13:35:03 ooo :) tcn works on isforth... where do I set it to use backspace (^h) as the as the delete key? 13:44:53 not sure. you could start by looking at 'query' 13:45:16 i440r's changed it a lot since I got it working :) 13:50:35 --- quit: Etaoin ("raise KeyError, "I'll bet that's the last time you lock them in the car..."") 14:03:04 * dsmith is back (gone 01:16:41) 14:05:18 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 14:28:49 --- quit: Herkamire ("leaving") 14:34:14 --- quit: dsmith (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 14:34:27 dammit, i'm gonna be bankrupt if this doesn't stop! 14:47:30 --- join: kc5tja (~kc5tja@stampede.org) joined #forth 14:48:09 halloo 14:48:17 Howdy 14:48:31 You folks probably won't be seeing me for about a week or so. Vacation time. 15:00:57 --- join: Blandest (~bland@h24-65-137-230.ed.shawcable.net) joined #forth 15:02:56 I completely forgot how long I've been using OPN. It's at least been since linpeople.org was announced. 15:03:04 Wow...am I really that old? ;) 15:05:13 No, older. 15:05:15 :) 15:05:28 You're right... :( 15:05:48 This aging thing must come to an end. Sue Microsoft!!! 15:06:12 And while I'm at it, I want to purchase all rights to Commodore computers, and go back into business under the Commodore name. But that'll never happen either. *sigh* 15:11:36 Hello. 15:11:43 re Blandest 15:12:42 who has the Commodore name, anyhow? 15:13:17 I forget who, but I can't find their old website. I think Tulip used to have it, but they sold it. 15:13:43 ack. that has been a long-running fantasy of mine as well, not that I have even .1% the money required 15:14:03 * kc5tja nods 15:15:09 * kc5tja ponders whether the 8-bit machines could have kept selling and improving, compared to the 16- and 32-bit machines, seeing as how they're so much cheaper to produce. 15:15:37 I mean, would a 50MHz 6502 compete against a 50MHz 80486? They're really close in performance at the byte level. 15:15:59 at the byte level, but I seldom move individual bytes around 15:16:48 and 6502 is really register-starved, so as RAM gets comparatively slower, 6502 fares progressively worse 15:17:23 Yeah, but most applications a home computer is likely to run will be I/O limited anyway. 15:17:24 but you could fit everything in SRAM 15:17:34 But, oh well. It was just a thought. 15:18:03 64k SRAM on the CPU chip 15:19:51 but that defeats the cost advantages 15:21:06 --- quit: Blandest ("bye") 15:21:32 brb 15:36:50 hmz.. planar->chunky with 4 non-HAM planes and emulated copper clocked once/8 hires pixels, >30Mpix/sec with copper waiting on a P100 with S3 video 15:37:43 almost enough to emulate an A500 in fullspeed on the same machine 15:39:38 back 15:39:40 * kc5tja nods 15:39:58 * kc5tja wishes AGA was supported under Linux though. :) 15:40:41 * XeF4 wishes he had an AGA miggy with MMU 15:40:51 Dude, I *WILL* get one...I swear it. 15:40:57 * kc5tja WILL get an Amiga 4000 one of these days... 15:41:49 I should soon have an A1200 with 68060 on indefinite loan 15:42:06 Nice. I wish I could have something like that. 15:42:28 When's the A1200 from? 15:42:52 1993(?) 15:43:46 Yup 15:43:50 1992/1993 there abouts. 15:43:55 Ditto for the Amiga 4000. 15:44:07 afaik, A4000 is a few months older 15:44:27 Yeah, but not much older. They were quick in succession as I recall. 15:45:29 I also want a PowerPC processor upgrade for it too. 15:46:05 I mean, I love 680x0 processors a lot. But PowerPCs are really cool CPUs too. 15:46:25 yeah 15:46:27 get a mac, kc5 15:48:50 what is the PPC instruction set like? haven't looked. 15:50:00 Are these CPUs little-endian? 15:50:27 HUM.. do I want to spend EUR 130 (plus some for the train ticket to pick it up) on a A1200 with 28MHz turbo board 15:50:32 68k is big-endian 15:51:03 Bah. 15:51:07 >:( 15:52:15 this wouldn't be an issue with 8 bits :) 15:53:04 wouldn't be an issue with a strictly word-addressed machine 15:53:18 Hehe. 15:55:18 i used to believe big-endian was better cause everyone said so. then I learned 80x86 assembly.. 15:55:58 I used to believe big-endian was better for some irrational reasons about coinciding with numeral-writing conventions 15:56:05 then I started using low tags on multiword values 15:56:44 yeah, written numbers, that's why 15:57:16 but you end up accessing the low byte of a word quite a bit.. 16:05:07 n_: I've considered it, but they're *WAY* too expensive. 16:05:27 XeF4: It's RISC; almost like MIPS, but not quite. 16:05:50 rob_ert: Big-endian, little-endian, what's the difference? 16:06:16 PowerPC is big-endian by default, but can also support little-endian operation. 16:06:43 Hmm.. 16:07:08 In fact, the PowerPC has instructions that loads and stores values in ANY endianness, so who cares what mode it's set for? 16:07:26 Well, I like to be able to mov 8/16/32-bit register,[mem_address] and get the same value in all cases (assuming the variable fits in all registers). 16:07:32 * kc5tja admits to prefering little-endian over big-endian, but really, it's not that important. 16:07:42 Hehe. 16:07:52 I guess a cleaner design does more :) 16:08:03 rob_ert: I couldn't care less. If you're moving a 32-bit value into a location, and reading it back as an 8-bit value, you have a type conflict. 16:08:25 I can say this much though: little endian SSUUCCKKSS!! when doing bitmapped graphics manipulation. 16:09:18 :) 16:09:27 depends how the planes are ordered. if they're ordered low-bit-first, it's quite ok 16:09:44 XeF4: No, that only makes things worse. 16:09:56 how so? 16:10:18 Because little-endian CPUs store data little-endian byte ordering, BIG ENDIAN BIT ORDERING. 16:10:31 That is, the most significant bit in x86 is '7', not '0'. 16:10:43 *nod* 16:10:49 Current graphics hardware just isn't made that way. 16:11:09 Not until you get into 16-bit and 32-bit graphics modes. 16:11:45 Even 24-bit graphics modes can be a problem sometimes, but when you start doing true-color, bit-level manipulations is usually greatly reduced anyway, so it's not as much of a problem. 16:11:48 but for manipulation without directly displaying to graphics hardware, I store it that way internally 16:12:26 Well, I'm starting to move away from storage and manipulation of bitmaps and moving towards scene graphs for everything I do graphically. 16:12:35 Lots of nice properties come about from it. 16:22:04 --- quit: tcn ("Leaving") 16:23:06 *nod* 16:27:33 Well, much as I'd love to chat, I'm now officially on vacation. :) 16:27:42 Gotta go. 16:27:48 later 16:27:51 --- quit: kc5tja ("THX QSO ES 73 DE KC5TJA/6 CL ES QRT AR SK") 17:19:25 --- join: TheBlueWizard (TheBlueWiz@ip-216-25-205-199.vienna.va.fcc.net) joined #forth 17:19:32 hiya all 17:20:25 Hi :) 17:20:46 hiya rob_ert...anything new? 17:21:07 Uhm, not really. 17:22:03 mmhmm 19:27:10 bye all 19:27:19 --- part: TheBlueWizard left #forth 19:43:55 --- join: tathi (~josh@ip68-9-68-213.ri.ri.cox.net) joined #forth 20:05:30 --- join: air (~brand@12-254-199-50.client.attbi.com) joined #forth 20:18:48 --- quit: XeF4 ("ja nyt dyykkaamaan") 21:24:20 --- quit: tathi ("leaving") 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/02.06.28