00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.06.09
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07:26:32 <rob_ert> Hi tcn :)
07:26:35 <tcn> hey
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07:32:03 <Speuler> g'day
07:32:38 <tcn> howdy
07:32:52 <Speuler> hi tcn
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08:03:02 <tcn> hey i440
08:03:20 <I440r> tcn!! hi
08:03:25 <I440r> someone was stealing your nick the other day lol
08:03:27 <I440r> som imposter!!!!!!!!!!
08:03:37 <I440r> i created a freshmeat account for isforht and my hits went balistic heh
08:04:10 <I440r> i was looking at the assembler you were writing before
08:04:15 <I440r> how come you dont finish it :P
08:04:28 <I440r> it looks like you were on exactly the right track
08:07:28 <I440r> ok you can open your eyes now..... he
08:12:07 <tcn> heh
08:12:18 <I440r> aha there you are heh
08:12:37 <tcn> you could finish it
08:12:44 <I440r> i doubt it
08:13:05 <I440r> i have absolutely no idea how to code an assembler in forth or otherwise.
08:13:14 <I440r> ive got a realy neat 8051 disassembler
08:13:24 <I440r> i know the 8051 instruction encoding almost by heart
08:13:35 <I440r> i STILL dont think i could code an 8051 assember
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08:17:09 <I440r> so how long would it take you to throw something together ?
08:17:23 <I440r> if you started it i could work on it too
08:17:37 <I440r> not being able to do coded defs is realy a bitch
08:17:37 <tcn> i did start it.. it won't be like nasm though
08:17:46 <I440r> doesnt NEED to be
08:17:46 <tcn> hang on.. dogs
08:17:56 <I440r> as long as it isnt 5 # ax mov lol
08:18:02 <I440r> werf!
08:18:18 <I440r> we got a dog now. looks more like a wolf. it was a stray
08:18:49 <I440r> and i gotta go take it to get groomed in a minute heh
08:19:52 <tcn> oh cool :)
08:20:05 <I440r> so your working on an assembler NOW ???
08:20:07 <I440r> you mean ?
08:20:09 <tcn> no
08:20:25 <I440r> argh what do i have to bribe you with to get you back on track :P
08:20:43 <tcn> for you it just needs to assemble the instructions you actually use.. but MOV is pretty complex
08:21:12 <I440r> tcn it can start out supporting only the ones i use but it has to support ALL - including fpu (eventually)
08:21:30 <I440r> mov is 2376527845674 different instructions all with the same name :P
08:21:35 <tcn> yup
08:21:45 <tcn> we don't need NASM macros or anything though
08:21:58 <I440r> not even
08:22:30 <I440r> it doesnt need to be a nasm look alike as long as its intel heh
08:23:55 <I440r> tom zimmer had to nag and nag the guy that did his assembler heh
08:23:55 <tcn> ok.. i see how to do it.
08:24:36 <I440r> fill me in :)
08:24:42 <tcn> syntax is like [label[:]] [instruction] [operand][,operand] [;...]
08:24:58 <I440r> erm the comments are going to be in the form \ comment
08:25:06 <tcn> ok, whatever
08:25:09 <I440r> ;aifahflkahfklahdfk wont be the format
08:25:10 <I440r> but yes
08:25:39 <I440r> but that format looks good yes
08:25:59 <tcn> at the beginning of a line you scan the instruction dict.. if not found, define a label..
08:26:08 <tcn> in the label dict
08:26:30 <I440r> label vocabulary can be the headerless vocabulary
08:26:41 <I440r> or work in the same way...
08:27:08 <I440r> erm no. labels are global. not beheadded later. heh
08:27:24 <I440r> erm one problem
08:27:40 <I440r> when in the assembler we still need to be able to do normal forth
08:27:51 <I440r> so a global label needs to be
08:27:52 <tcn> you have 'eval'?
08:27:54 <I440r> label  foo
08:27:55 <I440r> no
08:28:02 <I440r> and i will NOT support that abomination
08:28:11 <I440r> coded defs need to start
08:28:12 <I440r> code foo
08:28:14 <I440r>  ...
08:28:16 <I440r>  ...
08:28:18 <I440r>  end-code
08:28:36 <I440r> the word code puts the assembler vocabulary in context
08:28:45 <I440r> and starts the foo definition
08:28:50 <tcn> ok, you can do it that way I guess
08:28:51 <I440r> end-code may or may not be required
08:29:16 <I440r> label can be defined as
08:29:20 <tcn> use that assembler I started, where instructions are defined as words
08:29:37 <I440r> erm no i need to think of this
08:29:44 <tcn> but they'll call an infix parser, none of this stack crap
08:30:07 <I440r> tcn the assembler you started is not far enough along for me to continue
08:30:14 <I440r> seriously isnt :(
08:30:25 <tcn> I'M gonna look at it again
08:30:38 <I440r> cool
08:30:53 <tcn> you know how it's got control constructs?
08:30:58 <I440r> yes
08:31:03 <I440r> isforth now supports structures
08:31:09 <I440r> you created an array and then defined
08:31:12 <tcn> you won't need many labels
08:31:13 <I440r> 0 constant foo
08:31:18 <I440r>  4 constant blah
08:31:34 <I440r> headerless coded words could start with
08:31:35 <I440r> label blah
08:31:53 <I440r> the workd BLAH shouldnt show up in the dictionary
08:32:03 <I440r> other than as a constant or something
08:32:31 <I440r> but we might be able to do the same thing with my headerless word creation words
08:32:33 <I440r> <headers
08:32:35 <I440r>  code foo
08:32:36 <I440r>  ...
08:32:37 <I440r>  ...
08:32:38 <I440r>  ...
08:32:41 <I440r>  end-code
08:32:44 <I440r> headers>
08:32:46 <I440r> then beheade
08:32:50 <tcn> that's better
08:33:07 <I440r> prolly
08:33:20 <I440r> but label is reauired i think
08:33:38 <tcn> can't you just use .0 thru .9?
08:33:51 <I440r> making headerless words adds visual clutter to the sources and it can become confusing whats got a header and what doestn
08:33:56 <I440r> for LOCAL labels yes
08:33:57 <tcn> the simple thing is to define .0 thru .9 as words
08:34:01 <tcn> yeah, for locals
08:34:04 <I440r> but for global labels where ANY source can do
08:34:10 <I440r>  call foo
08:34:15 <I440r> or jmp blah
08:34:36 <tcn> hmm..
08:34:44 <tcn> define them as words, right?
08:34:53 <I440r> neway i gotta take doggie to be gromed (yes labels would be constants)
08:34:59 <tcn> ok
08:35:26 <I440r> but you wouldnt be able to put a global label INSIDE a coded definition
08:35:37 <tcn> unless you have 'label'
08:35:38 <I440r> not sure if any allow that
08:35:44 <I440r> no even WITH label
08:35:53 <I440r> : label here constant ;
08:35:56 <I440r> code foo
08:35:58 <I440r>  blah blah
08:36:02 <I440r> label xyzzy
08:36:14 <tcn> that'll work
08:36:23 <I440r> inside the definition for foo you now have the definition for a constant
08:36:34 <I440r> so when you execute foo you will run into where the constant waas compiled
08:36:40 <tcn> oh oh
08:36:46 <tcn> forth sucks
08:36:53 <I440r> so --- it wont work if the gloabl is in the middle of an already started function
08:36:54 <I440r> no
08:36:56 <I440r> actually
08:37:05 <I440r> its a restriction but it forces good coding heh
08:37:17 <I440r> a global label in the middle of a function is bad :P
08:37:28 <I440r> it SHOULD be factored into a seperate entity heh
08:37:34 <I440r> and shared by all who need it
08:37:40 <tcn> then you don't need it
08:37:45 <I440r> correct
08:37:56 <tcn> if you want a fall-thru you can just leave out 'ret'
08:37:59 <I440r> plus we can actally fix it later to allow that sort ofthing
08:38:21 <I440r> i need to go - be here later ill tell you some plans for isforth vocabularies
08:38:27 <I440r> i gotta take doggie :)
08:38:31 <I440r> gotta log off
08:38:33 <tcn> ok, see ya
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09:37:39 <I440r> hi fare
09:37:39 <I440r> im trying to write an isforth tutorial
09:42:13 <Fare> good
09:43:24 <I440r> problem is im crap at writing heh
09:43:46 <I440r> and i probably have 80% spelling errors hehehe
09:44:55 <rob_ert> I beleive you >:)
09:45:26 <I440r> rob shaddap :)P
09:45:37 <I440r> go finish that sockets stuff. im gona need it soon :P
09:45:59 <I440r> and its realy not very much code you need to port over :P
09:46:18 <rob_ert> Awww... I'm doing other things ,9
09:47:39 <I440r> bleh
09:47:47 <I440r> you suck :P
09:47:47 <I440r> heh
09:50:51 <rob_ert> :)))
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10:01:51 <I440r> muswt be having problems
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10:56:16 <rob_ert> futhin, my baby!
10:56:26 <futhin> rob_ert, my mum!
10:56:32 <rob_ert> :}
10:56:45 <futhin> no, i lie
10:57:10 <futhin> if you were ever a mom, there'd be aborted fetuses strewn around the house as you hacked some evil VB!
10:57:43 <rob_ert> lol but vb is cool good fast program easy learn windows powerful lol really!!!
10:57:59 <rob_ert> (That's for grammarpolice)
10:58:20 <futhin> already caught up in the fantasy of your cocaine-induced world i see!?
10:58:31 <rob_ert> Yum.
10:59:33 --- mode: ChanServ set +o futhin
10:59:49 <rob_ert> u got p0wa!
11:00:02 <davidw> my neighbours are assholes
11:00:09 --- topic: set to 'Our mantra: Good code is written code | Forth code repository - http://doesnotexist.yet | BEAR you idiot! "BEAR guns" is correct | Pessimists are stupid losers, get lost' by futhin
11:00:41 <futhin> get lost all you foul mouthed pessimists!
11:00:56 <futhin> stop being liars and calling yourself a "realist"
11:00:57 <futhin> lol!
11:01:29 --- topic: set to 'Our mantra: Good code is written code | Forth code repository - http://doesnotexist.yet | BEAR you idiot! "BEAR guns" is correct' by futhin
11:01:36 <futhin> davidw: that's ok, you are an asshole too
11:01:50 <davidw> thanks - fuck you too!
11:02:17 <futhin> davidw: lol, i'm being truthful, i'm not insulting you
11:02:31 <davidw> I *am* insulting you:-)
11:02:58 <davidw> but I'm allowed to - I'm an asshole
11:03:00 <futhin> that's cause you are a moron that hangs out on #forth for some undiscernable reason and tries to insult forth every chance you get
11:03:06 <futhin> i'm a nice guy
11:03:32 <futhin> unfortunately i'm a nice guy, but it means long-term power, so i stick with it
11:04:38 <futhin> davidw: whenever i read #forth logs and see some of the foul stuff that comes out of your mouth i wonder why i shouldn't ban you or harass you
11:05:17 <davidw> because you know I'm right
11:05:22 <futhin> lol
11:05:25 <futhin> afraid not
11:05:32 <rob_ert> I'm a realist.
11:05:35 <futhin> you are filled with misconceptions
11:05:41 * futhin kickbans rob_ert!
11:05:42 <davidw> afraid so.
11:05:43 <rob_ert> ;)
11:06:02 <Fare> reality is a fareist
11:06:07 <futhin> rob_ert: trust me when i say this.  you are not a realist.  you are too young ;P
11:06:22 <futhin> or not, nevermind
11:07:37 <futhin> you have to be a bit of an asshole to be a realist too..  and unfortunately 90% of the population are realists..  that 90% of the population for all intents and purposes are never truely successful
11:08:19 <futhin> they never achieve any kind of freedom, be it wealth or something else
11:08:40 <futhin> s/they never/they almost never/
11:09:59 <rob_ert> futhin: "Confidence is the feeling you get before you've grasped the sutiation."
11:10:26 <futhin> realists are kind of stupid, they block out so much perspective, they shut their minds to many things
11:11:28 <futhin> rob_ert: how old are you?
11:11:31 <rob_ert> It's better to lie to yourself.
11:11:42 <rob_ert> futhin: sqrt(Chuck's age)
11:11:46 <futhin> no, why lie to yourself at all
11:12:23 <rob_ert> To feel better?
11:12:39 <futhin> sure, but that is short term
11:12:52 <futhin> long-term you are worse off
11:13:18 <futhin> lying to yourself creates shackles..  harder to get freedom in life
11:14:50 <rob_ert> So? Are we young supposed to think longer than our noses reach?
11:15:02 <futhin> realists have the wrong perspective, but they take comfort because they are pulling themselves down to the level of everyone else..  and everyone else around them is happy that the realists are at the same level
11:16:09 <futhin> people will pat you on the back if you try to do something extraordinary and fail, people will laugh and be like "i told you so" and then feel secure that it cannot be done
11:16:34 <rob_ert> So, what's happend to you, futhin?
11:16:49 <futhin> nothing, just telling you how people are
11:17:09 <davidw> we should feel honored that we have someone present who knows 'how people are'
11:17:10 <futhin> no bad experiences on my part, i've succeeded, not failed :P
11:17:14 <rob_ert> I mean, did you bring all this up because you had nothing better to do?
11:17:34 <futhin> yes
11:17:49 <futhin> leaving in 10 minutes or so
11:17:49 * rob_ert thinks . o O ( Futhin succeded? Heh... that can't be )
11:18:17 <futhin> mentally
11:18:58 <rob_ert> I see.
11:19:31 <futhin> hm
11:21:32 <futhin> rob_ert: so what do you want to do in life?   get a degree, get a job, get a wife, get a house, get some kids, get a dog, retire, die?
11:23:16 <rob_ert> Almost, no dog.
11:23:25 <futhin> ok
11:23:29 <futhin> so what's the point of life?
11:23:35 <futhin> what's the meaning of life?
11:23:42 <rob_ert> Meaning? Hah
11:23:46 <rob_ert> Religious blaha.
11:23:50 <futhin> i'm not talking about religious
11:23:59 <futhin> i'm just talking about personal meaning of life
11:24:21 <rob_ert> Try to be happy, and look at all the other ones who seem to be happier?
11:24:26 <davidw> how about this: having a lot of great sex
11:24:30 <futhin> fool, why would i have any religious conotations to whatever i say? :P
11:24:45 <rob_ert> davidw: That's YOUR goal, maybe.
11:25:14 * futhin is the greatest unbeliever, the greatest & truest skeptic, and is also an optimistic idealistic nice guy ;P
11:25:55 <rob_ert> Nice guy? Suuuuuure ;D
11:26:28 * futhin really needs to write essays and stuff, to become a better writer
11:26:37 <rob_ert> I forget my swedish :(
11:26:54 <futhin> you know more english than swedish?
11:28:15 <futhin> realists are actually pessimists and false skeptics
11:28:22 <futhin> they are not true realists
11:29:28 <futhin> they are especially false skeptics because they have more faith in humanity than they should.  they are biased about humanity and think humans are the greatest thing and are superior, etc etc blahblah crapcrap
11:29:47 --- mode: futhin set -o futhin
11:30:16 <rob_ert> :)
11:30:26 <rob_ert> futhin: No, I forget both of them :D
11:30:31 <rob_ert> And german, too.
11:31:57 <futhin> ah good
11:32:14 <futhin> as yoda says: you must first unlearn stuff!
11:32:27 <rob_ert> Uhh...
11:32:48 <rob_ert> Yoda is a strange guy in Star Wars. Don't listen to him.
11:35:13 <futhin> unlearn the languages
11:35:28 <futhin> they are crap
11:35:33 <futhin> learn telepathy!
11:37:54 <rob_ert> Sure.
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12:08:26 --- mode: ChanServ set +o futhin
12:09:26 --- topic: set to 'Our mantra: Good code is written code | Forth code repository - http://doesnotexist.yet |  <futhin> the fact is that forth is in a pathetic state of development right now' by futhin
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13:50:18 <rob_ert> Hey
13:52:03 <I440r> hi
13:53:23 <I440r> brb :)
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15:33:46 <I440r> back
15:34:00 <I440r> took doggie for a walk
15:34:30 * davidw is definitely a cat person
15:45:47 <Fare> are you catwoman?
15:46:33 <davidw> nope
15:46:35 <davidw> that's rob_ert
15:47:56 <I440r> heh
15:49:59 <futhin> i'd like cats if my cat didn't shed so much hair
15:50:20 <I440r> lol
15:50:31 <I440r> this dog is a purebreed alaskan husky
15:50:38 <futhin> i like dogs better, dogs are smarter than cats
15:50:42 <davidw> you can actually get hairless cats, but they are kind of disgusting
15:50:44 <I440r> VERY thick fur heh
15:50:44 <I440r> and lots of it :P
15:50:49 <futhin> people just anthromorphize cats WAYYY too much
15:51:03 <futhin> cats = stupid, dogs = smarter
15:51:09 <davidw> dogs are 'smarter' in the sense that they understand your commands
15:51:12 <futhin> chimpanzees = can drive and smoke at the same time
15:51:33 <davidw> cats are smarter in that they sit around all day, don't eat their own shit, and don't take stupid orders from people like 'chase the ball'
15:52:31 <I440r> :)
15:53:29 <Fare> humans are smarter in that they can give the orders
15:53:46 <Fare> but they are also dumber in that they usually follow the orders.
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15:55:05 <CrowKiller> hi
15:59:06 <I440r> hi
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16:39:22 <futhin> wow, suddenly everybody is quiet
16:39:27 <futhin> i'm on like 16 channel
16:39:28 <futhin> i'm on like 16 channels
16:40:43 <I440r> but your not an adict right ?
16:41:50 <futhin> an irc addict?
16:41:54 <futhin> no not really
16:42:05 <futhin> usually hang on a few channels
16:42:08 <futhin> not 16
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16:46:33 <I440r> hi n :)
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16:55:04 <I440r> woohoo i have 325 megs of 633 :)
16:56:51 <I440r> and its only taken me a week so far
17:01:59 <_n_> 633?
17:01:59 <_n_> what file is this?
17:01:59 <_n_> forthosv4.3.iso? :)
17:02:49 <I440r> no
17:02:49 <I440r> freebsd heh
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18:23:39 <CrowKiller> hi
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18:46:34 <futhin> hi onetom
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