00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.05.15
00:02:45 --- join: male (~male@sdn-ap-009tnnashP0372.dialsprint.net) joined #forth
00:03:29 <male> Do we not speak?
00:07:24 --- join: davidw (~davidw@adsl-243-109.38-151.net24.it) joined #forth
00:09:46 <male> Are you the silent type as well?
00:10:45 --- quit: male ("BitchX: now with flavor crystals!")
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03:17:11 --- nick: Juk -> Juu
03:42:26 <davidw> how to read a byte at a time from a file?
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05:20:58 <Juu> agh
05:20:59 <Juu> evil
05:21:11 <Juu> the tiem seems to be running out and i still have not certainity about one thing
05:22:00 <Juu> and agh!
05:22:11 <Juu> i have to do some more serchenglinen
05:22:19 <Juu> ah, ow, i have one book might have about it
05:22:20 <Juu> yay
05:22:24 <Juu> gtchk
05:27:37 <Juu> agh
05:27:38 <Juu> no
05:30:53 <Juu> this one not either
05:30:59 <Juu> oh dear :P
05:31:23 <Juu> could there be somethign else too or just one, i have used | between, that can mean there are 2 itmes or 2 words separated
05:31:38 <Juu> damn with me
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06:09:19 <Juu> re tathi
06:09:33 <Juu> tathi, if your nick was tahti, it woudl mean beat in finnish
06:09:34 <Juu> :)
06:45:12 <tathi> :)
06:46:31 <Juu> lisää tahtia!
06:46:32 <Juu> :)
06:47:54 <tathi> heh
06:48:05 <tathi> I'm not paying a lot of attention, as you may have noticed :)
06:49:00 <Juu> me neither :)
06:49:08 <Juu> as you didn't noticed :)
06:52:20 <tathi> you hear back from art schools yet?
06:52:44 <Juu> nawp
06:52:52 <Juu> weekend around i should
06:53:34 <Juu> though, i dont know
06:54:00 <Juu> the first one i applied, it's only polytechnic, i apparenty didnt got to tests, though works were not so good at all anyways
07:05:00 --- nick: Juu -> JuFood
07:20:15 --- nick: JuFood -> JuuOut
07:58:59 --- nick: JuuOut -> JUu
07:59:02 --- nick: JUu -> Juu
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09:24:03 <rob_ert> Hej GilbertBSD.
09:24:13 <GilbertBSD> hi ro_bert
09:24:23 <GilbertBSD> rob_ertbsd
09:24:36 <GilbertBSD> dsbtreb ;)
09:25:11 <Juu> robsd
09:25:25 <GilbertBSD> Murr juu
09:25:25 <rob_ert> :D
09:25:32 <rob_ert> Brumm Juu
09:25:32 <Juu> murr!
09:25:42 <GilbertBSD> haha
09:25:56 * Juu eats swedish bear for breakfast
09:30:25 <rob_ert> =D
09:30:54 <Juu> or anything that says brumm
09:31:00 <Juu> it sounds like car to me
09:31:06 <Juu> are swedish bears mechanical?
09:31:08 <Juu> hmm..
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09:42:24 <rob_ert> Hoi :)(
09:44:44 <Juu> h00
09:49:18 <futhin> i'm getting tired of all this "hi, hej, murr, hoi, etc"  heh
09:49:25 <rob_ert> :)
09:49:48 <rob_ert> Why should we act like stupid americans when we're stupud europeans?
09:49:54 <futhin> we shouldn't greet each other, except with forth questions :P
09:50:02 <futhin> or forth statements
09:50:05 * rob_ert writes a new forth.
09:50:17 <futhin> are you coding a forth in forth?
09:50:17 <rob_ert> I'll see how much that will fit in 512 bytes.
09:50:22 <rob_ert> Not really.
09:50:24 <futhin> asm?
09:50:26 <rob_ert> asm
09:50:28 <rob_ert> Yes
09:50:49 <futhin> have you considered doing any programming IN forth? :P
09:51:51 * GilbertBSD is practicing his hello world in Forth.
09:52:02 <rob_ert> Hehe
09:52:03 <GilbertBSD> Perhaps I should write a book ON forth and how to program IN forth.
09:52:14 <rob_ert> Well... I should do some forth coding soon ;-)
09:52:31 <GilbertBSD> the first 3 chapters will be "this is all you need" and the remaining will involve thinking forthlike to write forthlike.
09:52:34 <Juu> futhin yes, but i'm not greeting i'm saying just MURR which doenstmean anything
09:52:34 <Juu> :)
09:52:42 * rob_ert thinks about writing a forth for an OS without any forth.
09:53:00 <GilbertBSD> Juu: you said it _meant_ something.
09:53:07 <futhin> juu: yeah, but it's still noise... none of the yaking above had any content :P
09:53:20 <Juu> GilbertBSD i say much but still dont mean anything  ;)
09:53:27 <GilbertBSD> Murrrr.
09:53:28 <davidw> why don't you go write some *libraries* instead of yet another stupid implementation
09:53:30 <Juu> murr!
09:53:47 <GilbertBSD> davidw:  I am gonna write a whole book.
09:53:50 <futhin> davidw: why don't you go invent a library system? :P
09:53:52 <Juu> why dont YOU go write some libraries instead of blaming "murr"s and other 
09:54:08 <GilbertBSD> I find I can think fairly easily in pythonic terms, but when it comes to forth, I can't really think forthlike.
09:54:20 <futhin> read Thinking Forth
09:54:32 <rob_ert> Stop thinking.
09:54:37 <futhin> this channel blurrs your thinking
09:54:39 <rob_ert> Start forthing.
09:54:46 <futhin> this channel is NOT CONDUCIVE to your forth thinking
09:54:47 <futhin> trust me
09:55:02 <futhin> <-- has a hard time remembering how to forththink in this channel
09:55:09 <rob_ert> (never trust a futhin)
09:55:23 <GilbertBSD> futhin:  I can't get a copy of Thinking forth :(
09:55:28 <GilbertBSD> What forth needs is an SICP...
09:55:32 <futhin> SICP?
09:55:48 <GilbertBSD> I think there is a lot of handwaving in forth... it is implicitly assumed that one knows asm
09:56:13 <rob_ert> You don't?
09:56:13 <GilbertBSD> so a better intro to ASM _and_ FORTH or Forth and ASM would be to not neglect the asm part of it all.
09:56:17 <futhin> no, you don't need to know asm
09:56:33 <futhin> i rarely think about asm whenever i code in forth..
09:56:34 * rob_ert thinks it's a very good idea to know asm.
09:56:38 <futhin> you don't need to know it
09:56:41 <rob_ert> Well
09:56:42 <rob_ert> Not really.
09:56:44 <futhin> it's a good idea to know it, but you don't
09:56:46 <GilbertBSD> right futhin... but how are you going to know what to do with whatever virgin chip you encounter?
09:57:09 <GilbertBSD> The other day, I wanted to make my pc speaker do something other than beep.
09:57:21 <futhin> GilbertBSD: who cares about the virgin chips?  you don't need to know asm if you want to code an application in forth..
09:57:27 <GilbertBSD> It was then I realised that if I did not know asm, there was no way the chip was gonna sing for me.
09:57:42 <GilbertBSD> I did want to code an application...
09:58:02 <onetom> hi guys :) ur learnin fast (murr/brumm)
09:58:10 <GilbertBSD> so far I can do two things with the speaker... make it quiet or make it beep.
09:58:19 <futhin> in forth?
09:58:21 <GilbertBSD> I want it to make other tones based on frequency and time.
09:58:23 <GilbertBSD> Yes
09:58:33 <futhin> and you are using gforth or something lame?
09:58:50 <GilbertBSD> I have Tile, I have gforth, i have pfe, and then i have the bootloader for Freebsd.
09:58:52 <GilbertBSD> ALl forths
09:59:02 <futhin> isforth?
09:59:19 <GilbertBSD> isforth is not ready for Freebsd because I don't know enough asm to make it work
09:59:27 <GilbertBSD> I also don't have the latest nasm
09:59:38 <rob_ert> :-/
10:00:08 <rob_ert> The latest NASM version only contains Yuri's RDF code anyway ;)
10:00:10 <futhin> before you learn asm, try looking at the reference material on how to produce sound in the pc speaker..
10:00:20 <rob_ert> But you should have at least 0.98.16 or something
10:00:24 <GilbertBSD> futhin: they are interrupts!
10:00:30 <rob_ert> No.
10:00:32 <futhin> it's probably relatively easy and you probably won't need to know much asm at all
10:00:38 <rob_ert> Simple I/O
10:00:47 <rob_ert> Like a few lines of code.
10:00:51 <futhin> exactly
10:00:59 <rob_ert> Want to know how to do it? =)
10:01:13 <GilbertBSD> alright robert, write a simple pc speaker controller that accepts to items on the stack, one for frequency, the other for time.
10:01:37 <futhin> if he codes it, what will you do?
10:01:51 <futhin> after you have it, it'll be "completed" and what will you have learned? :P
10:01:53 <GilbertBSD> I will learn from it.
10:01:57 <futhin> lies
10:02:19 <GilbertBSD> futhin I will read the code thoroughly, memorize it if necessary, and try to reverse engineer it on another system.
10:02:20 <futhin> you'll learn more if you read the reference material, ask a few good questions and code it
10:02:31 <GilbertBSD> Dear rob_ert... that is ASM!
10:02:35 <GilbertBSD> I don't read ASM just yet.
10:02:35 <futhin> no
10:02:43 <rob_ert> So?
10:02:45 <rob_ert> Bah
10:02:48 <rob_ert> I'll rewrite it in C then
10:02:51 <futhin> no, it's possible to not do much in asm
10:02:59 <futhin> rob_ert: send it to me?
10:03:03 <futhin> the asm version..
10:03:09 <rob_ert> OK
10:03:12 <futhin> rob_ert: don't write it in C
10:03:13 <rob_ert> Privmsg?
10:03:14 <futhin> eww
10:03:16 <futhin> yes
10:03:17 <rob_ert> Hehe
10:03:18 <rob_ert> I won't :)
10:03:24 <rob_ert> (too damn lazy for that too)
10:03:27 <futhin> good
10:03:38 <futhin> easier to implement the damn thing in forth from asm 
10:03:47 <GilbertBSD> futhin wth am I gonna do with the ASM version?
10:04:04 <GilbertBSD> how does one translate from ASM to forth without first knowing ASM?
10:04:14 <GilbertBSD> it is a sham to say forth gets rid of ASM in that case!
10:04:48 <futhin> well duh, you take the asm code and you put it into the forth using CODE and UNCODE  and you end up with a word that you can use
10:05:27 <futhin> rob_ert: wtf?  IN and OUT are opcodes?
10:05:27 <GilbertBSD> so how do I know what I am putting in there is not evil code that is gonna trash my computer thoroughly?
10:05:55 <futhin> cause you aren't stupid enough to be using your root account
10:06:17 <rob_ert> futhin: Yes, heh...
10:06:23 <futhin> jeez, you never ever use your root account unless you are installing stuff
10:06:29 <futhin> your default account isn't a root account
10:06:42 <GilbertBSD> huh?
10:06:49 <rob_ert> btw, I explained the code to him.
10:07:02 <GilbertBSD> of course I don't use the root account!
10:07:07 <rob_ert> (translated to C :D)
10:07:08 <futhin> ok
10:08:05 <davidw> I don't think many free forth's have 'code'
10:08:12 <futhin> gforth does
10:08:18 <futhin> most forths i've seen do
10:08:30 <futhin> the forths that might not have it are the palm forths
10:08:41 <futhin> but most forths do
10:08:45 <rob_ert> What does 'code' do?
10:09:00 <futhin> CODE <asm code here> UNCODE
10:09:12 <davidw> dammit... fucking web programming
10:09:28 <davidw> I need to do a pie chart
10:09:28 <davidw> hrm
10:09:33 <futhin> CODE stupidwordname <asm code here> UNCODE   or something like that
10:09:36 <rob_ert> futhin: OK :-)
10:09:38 <davidw> or anything to indicate a percentage
10:09:43 <GilbertBSD> davidw:  you can do it easily in rebol ;)
10:09:52 <davidw> GilbertBSD: I doubt it
10:10:31 <GilbertBSD> Yes there is a learning curve.
10:10:40 <davidw> I doubt it does what I need in any case
10:12:13 <GilbertBSD> davidw:  may i ask what you are trying to do?
10:12:45 <davidw> create a pie chart or something similar dynamically, and portably
10:12:50 <davidw> - no external libs
10:13:21 <tathi> XML & SVG :P
10:14:21 <davidw> tathi: hrm... that will work?
10:14:22 <tathi> s/XML/XSLT/
10:14:31 <GilbertBSD> tathi what is SVG?
10:14:40 <GilbertBSD> Super Vehicle Gravity?
10:14:43 <tathi> Scalable Vector Graphics, or something like that
10:14:43 <davidw> damn every now and then some real hotties pass by my window
10:15:43 <tathi> davidw: saw a demo somewhere getting data from a database in some kind of XML, then using XSLT to transform it into an SVG document that was a bar graph or pie chart or some such
10:15:44 <GilbertBSD> davidw: you are in italia afterallA
10:15:48 <futhin> well get out and meet them, but wipe away your drool first ;)
10:16:30 <tathi> don't know if the implementations have caught up enough to actually do something like that IRL though :(
10:17:46 <GilbertBSD> tathi:  url?
10:19:05 <davidw> oh well
10:19:08 <davidw> girlfriend is here:-)
10:19:10 <davidw> bye
10:19:13 <futhin> heh
10:20:36 --- nick: Juu -> JuuBLB
10:21:16 <tathi> http://www.vbxml.com/snippetcentral/main.asp?lang=svg
10:21:27 <tathi> not the one I was thinking of, but looks like it has some code...
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10:38:22 <GilbertBSD> tathi:  ... do you know xml or xslt ?
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10:40:10 <I440r> hello ppl!
10:40:16 <rob_ert> Hi :)
10:40:19 <GilbertBSD> hi I440r
10:40:26 <I440r> :)
10:40:40 <rob_ert> Why the FUCK does bochs tranform all my semicolons to colons?!
10:40:55 <GilbertBSD> rob_ert:  Bochs has never liked you.
10:41:01 <GilbertBSD> Bochs loves me!
10:41:10 <rob_ert> Bah.
10:41:52 <I440r> opera just loaded in a web page then resized the page toabout 3 inches square
10:41:56 <I440r> ugh
10:42:06 <I440r> like it zoomed OUT on it
10:42:12 <I440r> how am i supposed to read that :P
10:42:32 <GilbertBSD> I440r:  you need 2 chickens and a goat.
10:42:47 <GilbertBSD> Recite these words "oommm Pahhh looom Pahhh zooo baah deee doo "
10:43:14 <I440r> rite
10:43:24 <I440r> neway my coffee pot just finished making coffee
10:43:29 <I440r> coffee fixes EVERYTHING
10:43:38 <GilbertBSD> coffee fix.
10:43:40 <GilbertBSD> :)
10:43:46 <futhin> yep, and gives you cancer too! ;)
10:45:07 <rob_ert> :D
10:45:17 <GilbertBSD> so futhin, what do you drink instead?
10:45:26 <rob_ert> Water?
10:45:44 <GilbertBSD> too many pollutants
10:46:27 <I440r> no. i use filtered water to make coffee with
10:46:46 <GilbertBSD> hahahah the coffee _is_ unfiltered!
10:46:48 <rob_ert> Oh... don't you take your water right from the river?
10:46:51 <I440r> hang on ill tell you how many PPM of polutants there are in the water ina minute
10:46:57 <GilbertBSD> I take off the killers clothes before letting him in.
10:47:10 <futhin> aren't you the killer?
10:47:19 <futhin> you take off the victim's clothes
10:47:50 <GilbertBSD> rob_ert:  which of _the_ rivers?
10:47:57 <GilbertBSD> there are many Rivers in the US
10:48:12 * futhin sings "everybody is a moron! ooooh how i love morons! we're a planet full of morons and i'm extremely cynical. i'm a moron, you are a moron, we alllllll are morons!"
10:48:47 <I440r> 23 PPM
10:48:50 * rob_ert wonders what futhin drinks
10:48:55 <I440r> now THAt is clean wateer :)
10:49:20 <futhin> 23 PPM of _what_ ?
10:49:28 <futhin> healthy minerals?
10:50:33 <GilbertBSD> futhin: just a few carcinogens.
10:50:43 <GilbertBSD> Anything is potentially carcinogenic.
10:50:43 <futhin> no, that's the coffee fool
10:50:49 <GilbertBSD> re
10:50:53 <futhin> orange juice will save u!
10:51:01 <futhin> bleh
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10:51:59 <GilbertBSD> futhin:  orange juice makes me sick.
10:52:08 <rob_ert> 23 PPM oranges in the juice.
10:52:51 <futhin> gilbert: freshly squeezed homemade orange juice makes you sick for what reason?
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10:55:34 <GilbertBSD> Umm I do not have an orange tree.
10:55:42 <GilbertBSD> The very oranges make me sick.
10:56:07 <GilbertBSD> I prefer Milk.
10:56:57 <I440r> i used to have a lime tree
10:57:34 <GilbertBSD> What happened to the poor tree?
10:57:39 --- nick: JuuBLB -> juuout
10:57:55 <I440r> dunno that was when i lived in madagasgar :)
10:58:05 <I440r> my father was working ona  tracking station for nasa
10:58:11 <I440r> i couldnt have been older than 3 :P
10:58:27 <I440r> but i remember the tree :)
10:58:33 <I440r> and our gardener...
10:58:33 <rob_ert> You lived at Madagaskar?
10:58:43 <I440r> he used to steal the grasshoppers we had caught and EAT them
10:58:49 <I440r> yes for a few years
10:58:54 <rob_ert> Hehe... nice
10:59:05 <I440r> spoke french then too - cant speak a word of it now tho
10:59:32 * rob_ert always thinks of Madagaskar in the same cathegory as Mongolia, Sudan and similar countries :)
11:00:04 <I440r> every year they dig up their dead and dance with them in celebration
11:00:05 <I440r> ugh
11:00:26 <GilbertBSD> rob_ert:  madagascar is not at all like Mongolia or Sudan
11:00:40 <GilbertBSD> Mongolia is in Asia, Sudan is in the Saharah
11:00:45 <rob_ert> Well... maybe a _bit_ more civilized.
11:00:47 <rob_ert> Yes..=
11:00:48 <rob_ert> Yes..?
11:00:54 <GilbertBSD> civilized?
11:01:02 <rob_ert> ;)
11:01:04 <GilbertBSD> that is a silly word btw.
11:01:08 <rob_ert> Well... I'll brb
11:01:09 <rob_ert> I know
11:01:15 <rob_ert> I'm a silly boy.
11:01:17 <rob_ert> Byebye
11:01:19 <GilbertBSD> madagascar is an island off the african continent
11:01:34 <I440r> gilbert is well versed in geogrophy :)
11:01:34 <rob_ert> I know.
11:01:37 <rob_ert> Heh
11:01:39 <rob_ert> Yeah
11:01:47 <rob_ert> He knows there are countries outside the US
11:01:48 <GilbertBSD> it is Neither asia nor africa.
11:01:49 <rob_ert> Bravo!
11:01:58 <rob_ert> It is africa.
11:02:11 <rob_ert> Just as much as Ireland is Europe.
11:02:14 <GilbertBSD> Go there sometime, and then let me know what oyu think.
11:02:19 <rob_ert> And yes - it is.
11:02:32 <rob_ert> No.
11:02:35 <rob_ert> Bye now.
11:02:46 <GilbertBSD> then don't make silly statements about mongolia, sudan or madagascar
11:06:18 <I440r> they are all third world countries
11:06:24 <I440r> thats what he meant
11:06:44 <GilbertBSD> Bah.
11:06:53 <GilbertBSD> A word invented not by those countries.
11:07:51 <GilbertBSD> Greece is a 3rd world country btw
11:11:13 <I440r> yup
11:11:16 <I440r> my sister lives in athens
11:12:02 <GilbertBSD> Georgia?
11:12:04 <GilbertBSD> j/k
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11:42:16 --- nick: juuout -> Juu
11:42:46 <Juu> re
12:47:36 --- nick: Juu -> JuuBBL
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12:52:31 <rob_ert> Hej GilbertBSD.
12:52:47 <GilbertBSD> Hi Rob_ert
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13:40:12 <rob_ert> Hi :)
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13:48:03 <GilbertBSD> semantics
13:48:09 <rob_ert> Hoi!
13:48:13 <GilbertBSD> Hej
13:48:16 <GilbertBSD> semantics
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13:53:13 <GilbertBSD> onetom: do you know anything about semantics?
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13:53:15 --- nick: gforth0 -> gforth
13:54:10 <kc5tja> brb
13:54:12 --- nick: kc5tja -> kc-meeting
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14:05:45 <I440r> hi
14:05:55 <GilbertBSD> hi I440r
14:05:58 <I440r> miket2: is a forth coder ?
14:06:17 <I440r> hi gilbert :)
14:06:45 <GilbertBSD> I440r:  do you know what is meant by semantics of a programming language?
14:07:12 <I440r> err not realy :)
14:09:27 <I440r> miket2: ?
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14:18:12 --- part: miket2 left #forth
14:21:25 <I440r> hrm i guess miket2 didnt WANT to talk
14:22:17 <rob_ert> I guess he hates all of us.
14:22:38 <Juu> why?
14:22:40 <Juu> who?
14:23:04 <I440r> or forth :)
14:24:42 * rob_ert .oO( I hate forth so much! What should I do? I know, I'll join #forth! )
14:27:41 <rob_ert> Hrm.. what does # do?
14:27:53 * Juu . o O ( wonders when will rob_ert go to sleep )
14:28:28 * rob_ert .oO( Ahh... school from 11.00 to 12.00 tomorrow... Murr... )
14:28:30 <Juu> anyone knows lithuania biggest teleoperator?
14:28:36 <Juu> rob_ert why?
14:28:54 <rob_ert> One of my 2 lessons is cancelled :)
14:30:17 * rob_ert smacks his forth for growing big.
14:30:26 <rob_ert> It's no one-sector forth OS anymore :(
14:31:44 <Juu> why only 2 lsesons+
14:31:45 <Juu> ?
14:32:21 <rob_ert> Hmm
14:32:25 <rob_ert> Why not? =)
14:34:54 <Juu> yes
14:34:59 <Juu> why, not?
14:53:59 --- nick: kc-meeting -> kc5tja
14:54:44 <rob_ert> wb kc5tja =)
14:59:36 <Juu> re
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15:12:22 <CrowKiller> hi
15:13:19 <rob_ert> Hi :)
15:14:09 <Juu> vapo
15:14:14 <Juu> sounds like finnish secret police
15:14:16 <Juu> old one
15:14:19 <Juu> valtiollinen poliisi
15:14:21 <Juu> or something
15:14:40 <rob_ert> Heh
15:14:42 <rob_ert> From when?
15:14:42 <CrowKiller> Vapo as in THC vaporizer ;o)
15:15:17 * rob_ert smacks CrowKiller with a Beatles record.
15:18:56 <CrowKiller> vaporizing is the only way to go
15:19:15 <CrowKiller> at least the best I know of lol
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16:51:48 --- quit: Juu ("MURR! end of file reached. continuing filling logs some other time.")
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17:06:02 * CrowKiller is doing his and his friend's semester work one day before the due date
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17:07:24 --- quit: kc5tja ("THX QSO ES 73 DE KC5TJA/6 CL ES QRT AR SK")
17:48:27 <I440r> hrm sounds greek to me :)
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23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/02.05.15