00:00:00 --- log: started forth/02.01.21 00:34:50 --- join: aum` (~aum@l76-137.world-net.co.nz) joined #forth 01:48:58 anyone awake? 01:54:06 more or less ;) 02:00:37 sort of 02:06:32 oh...hi 02:06:52 I just briefed through the gforth tutorial 02:06:56 very nice 02:07:23 anyway...gotta sleep 02:07:28 --- quit: kholmes ("good night") 02:25:35 --- quit: aum` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02:54:01 --- join: aum` (~aum@l76-137.world-net.co.nz) joined #forth 03:11:27 --- quit: aum` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10:12:23 --- join: XeF4_ (xef4@hd5e24739.gavlegardarna.gavle.to) joined #forth 10:30:17 --- quit: XeF4_ ("pois") 12:30:23 --- join: aum` (~aum@210.55.76.137) joined #forth 12:55:10 --- join: MrReach (~mrreach@209.181.43.190) joined #forth 12:57:02 --- join: futhin (Havoc36@ab-cal-a52-01-23.look.ca) joined #forth 12:57:24 hi 12:57:31 hihi 12:57:34 how are you? 12:57:52 pretty good 12:57:57 reading a book on daytrading right now :) 12:58:11 oh? why? 12:59:09 i'm interested in daytrading, i've read a number of daytrading and technical (risk) analysis books before 12:59:27 rough business 12:59:42 especially if you're successful 12:59:45 it is entirely possible to be successful at daytrading, with proper risk-taking, devotion of time, and enough computer monitors :P 12:59:57 HAHA! 12:59:59 rough business? why? i don't think so 13:00:11 no, I 'spose not 13:00:30 but I should think it would be quite nerve-wracking 13:00:44 it's probably adrenaline-based, but fun as hell, and requires a lot of discipline to stick to the rules that you establish for yourself 13:00:45 several of my wife's clients are day traders 13:00:59 yeah 13:01:07 they do quite well 13:01:29 you should hear them scream when the market adjusts, though 13:01:34 heh 13:01:43 yeah, you could try daytrading if you can handle the rush :P 13:02:00 actually, if I were going to do something like that ... 13:02:16 I'd go for professional sports betting 13:02:36 easier to figure who the winners are going to be 13:02:57 lol 13:03:13 LOTS of homework, though 13:03:22 i dunno, i'd disagree, stocks are easier :P 13:03:59 what term of investment are you talking about? 13:04:32 it might be more appropriate to ask "How do you expect to do your spread?" 13:05:30 HA! my wife would think i've gone totally bazonkers if I started reading the sports page every morning 13:06:12 well, stocks have more liquidity, and more volume, you can get in and out quickly, etc.. can make more money quicker.. and technical analysis is fun :P 13:06:12 (I'm notorious for hating organized sports leagues) 13:07:01 are you talking two hour trades? two days? two week? two month? 13:07:27 daytrading = no holding positions overnight 13:07:36 ok 13:07:41 but yeah, i'm talking 2 hours or less :P 13:08:00 what have you been able to find for broker commissions? 13:09:09 isn't NASDAQ open 24/7?? and several other floors? 13:10:02 there's after-hours trading, but the real trading times are 9 am to 11 am and 3:30 pm to 4:30 pm 13:10:22 a few daytraders are quite successful just trading during 9 am and 11 am 13:10:26 what have you been able to find for broker commissions? 13:10:41 well, there's different ways to do it 13:11:22 there's something called Level II Screens, which is software that connects directly to NASDAQ and lets you see all the bids and asks being made by market makers and brokerages, and you can make your own bids and asks 13:11:44 oh? I didn't know that 13:11:59 erm ... wouldn't that be serious money, though? 13:12:43 150 to 400 a month for that 13:13:00 no matter how small the transaction? 13:13:02 depending on the brokerage and the features you need 13:13:17 oh! 13:13:23 150 to 400 for the level II and the connection.. 13:13:27 you're trading directly on the floor, then? 13:13:36 NOT trading, rather 13:13:45 but rather through a brokerage's pool? 13:14:24 NASDAQ is completely electronic, it isn't like the NYSE which still has a floor 13:14:52 NASDAQ is where almost all the daytraders hang out on, and where most of the tech stocks are on 13:15:03 of course 13:15:05 NYSE is too slow, and is too corrupt 13:15:17 what about commodities markets and derivitives? 13:16:14 hmm, i know that there are some exchanges that specialize only in commodities, but it is possible that NASDAQ or NYSE also handle commodities 13:16:36 i dunno about derivities however 13:16:45 er, derivitives 13:16:51 derivitives apply to any market 13:17:57 yeah, but i don't know how they are represented in the market 13:18:20 that's a good question, ineed 13:18:23 indeed 13:18:25 some stocks might represent derivitives, like index stocks represet index funds 13:18:44 wouldn't the derivs be listed right next to the stock? 13:18:56 i dunno 13:19:06 where where you find out? 13:19:10 i haven't actually invested in stocks or anything yet :P 13:19:19 except for a mutual fund 13:19:32 derivatives, also, are influenced by the vagueries of human opinion 13:19:45 so there's money to be made there 13:20:23 i read a book on derivatives too :P 13:20:38 pretty corrupt stuff :) 13:21:26 heh 13:21:48 there's corruption in all places where large quantities of money exchange hands 13:22:21 stocks, real estate, military contracts, etc, etc 13:23:18 the whole wall street machine is the most beautiful and successful construct built to suck money from people. 13:23:38 I would agree with that 13:25:21 the people who built it are geniuses 13:28:21 i'm feeling like coding up my own level II software :P 13:28:37 heh 13:29:18 so what are you up to? 13:29:29 browsing mls listings again 13:29:32 i'm hanging on #daytraders on dalnet right now, and reading the book 13:39:15 is it possible for a small investor to make a profit on day trading without spending months/years studying the market? 13:42:56 um, the recommended amount of time to study the market is between 1 and 3 months.. but you have to do it fulltime if you are going to daytrade.. it's recommended you spend the first month just watching the market, and paper-trading (not actually using money), and then the next 2 months daytrading small, and a lot of daytraders don't start to make a profit until after 3 months.. 13:43:00 omg! 13:44:09 which is why you don't make large trades at all until after you are successful, after 3 months or so.. 13:44:11 8 unit rental, $167,500, near navel base, owner will 2nd finance remainer of assumable mortgage 13:44:49 is that a good deal? 13:44:57 8 units renting to navy ppl .. hmm 13:45:30 at 7.5% interest, the mort payment is $1,172 13:45:45 hm, and rent each unit at 500 bucks or what? 13:45:54 among 8 apts, that's $146.50 13:46:12 yes, they'll go between $350 and $450 each 13:46:23 hm, sounds like a good deal :) 13:46:58 the picture indicates that they need pain badly 13:47:02 paint 13:47:45 but even if they need $20,000 in repairs, putting the total mortgage at $187,500, they'll make damn good money 13:47:55 FOREVER 13:48:48 you say "they'll" does that mean you aren't going to bother with it? 13:49:50 beg parden? 13:50:01 no, not at all 13:50:09 I'm not prepared to jump just yet 13:50:25 you haven't made any real estate investments yet? 13:50:34 just the house I'm sitting in 13:50:52 yeah, doesn't really count tho :P 13:50:59 yes it does 13:51:07 it's appreciating while i'm in it 13:51:35 yeah, but that's not serious $$, not like buying other houses and getting tons of rent money ontop of the appreciation 13:51:51 there's never "tons" 13:52:21 when first purchased, you're lucky to get even money w/ expenses 13:52:40 but as time goes on, and rental rates climb gradually 13:52:47 you start making more and more money 13:53:18 more cash in pocket money, i should say 13:53:48 but if you own 400 units with nothing down ... 13:54:14 a rise of only $20/mo puts $8,000/mo in your pocket 14:07:54 hm 14:08:04 why should the rental rates climb? 14:08:13 the "nothing down" part is important 14:08:21 because ... 14:08:33 1. there are more people in Seattle area, not less 14:08:54 2. Inflation causes land/rental rates to rise 14:09:25 Boing just moved out of the state, there's probably LOTS of apts to be had near the factory for dirt cheap 14:11:51 hmm, cool 14:12:08 but if there's no people nearby you'll have to build a city around the apts :) 14:12:18 i'd do that if i had a lot of money, build my own city :P 14:12:30 no ... 14:12:48 because you buy so cheap, you can rent below market and still make payments 14:13:02 as boing business is replaced by others 14:13:10 market rates will rise again 14:13:34 Boeing leaving has created a temporarily depressed market 14:14:56 hmm, sounds like a cool opportunity i guess 14:15:32 so long as one can wait two years w/o getting all excited 14:15:41 * futhin afks 14:15:51 yeah, me too for a bit 14:15:55 --- nick: MrReach -> MrGone 14:51:39 --- quit: futhin ("-HAVOC- psych3d3|ic") 15:02:22 --- join: kholmes (~kholmes@client1071.sedona.net) joined #forth 15:29:34 --- quit: aum` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 15:42:56 --- quit: kholmes (Remote closed the connection) 15:45:36 --- join: kholmes (~kholmes@client1071.sedona.net) joined #forth 16:01:01 --- quit: MrGone () 16:19:03 * kholmes is away: food 16:35:29 * kholmes is back (gone 00:16:26) 16:44:59 * kholmes is away: learning forth 16:59:09 * kholmes is back (gone 00:14:10) 17:47:24 * kholmes is away: afk 17:47:37 --- quit: kholmes ("Client Exiting") 17:53:44 --- join: TheBlueWizard (TheBlueWiz@ip-216-25-205-169.vienna.va.fcc.net) joined #forth 17:53:56 hiya all...will be brief 18:36:50 bye 18:36:56 --- part: TheBlueWizard left #forth 19:07:52 --- join: aum` (~aum@l76-137.world-net.co.nz) joined #forth 21:00:58 --- join: kholmes (~kholmes@client547.sedona.net) joined #forth 21:39:21 --- quit: kholmes ("Client Exiting") 22:35:41 --- join: kholmes (~kholmes@client624.sedona.net) joined #forth 22:50:15 --- join: Speuler (~l@c38038.upc-c.chello.nl) joined #forth 22:52:30 'oi 23:01:29 is that a forth word I wasn't informed of? 23:27:54 feel free to define it 23:28:56 when pronounced, it probably sounds like dutch greeting by frenchman 23:30:14 dutch say "hoi" and french find "h" difficult :) 23:53:45 --- quit: kholmes ("Client Exiting") 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/02.01.21