00:00:00 --- log: started forth/01.07.25 02:17:20 --- join: adu (andrew@adsl-63-201-90-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 02:18:25 --- join: I440r_ (mark4@purplecoder.com) joined #forth 02:18:36 yo 02:18:46 --- quit: I440r (Read error to I440r[purplecoder.com]: Connection reset by peer) 02:53:53 --- join: I440r (mark4@purplecoder.com) joined #forth 02:54:15 --- quit: I440r_ (Read error to I440r_[purplecoder.com]: Connection reset by peer) 03:19:11 --- quit: adu (IRCStep) 09:29:13 --- join: nate37 (nate@cx83983-d.irvn1.occa.home.com) joined #forth 10:37:05 --- join: edrx (edrx@200.240.18.106) joined #forth 11:39:48 --- join: adu (andrew@adsl-63-201-90-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 11:47:24 --- nick: adu -> castAdu_w 11:53:45 --- join: geakazoid (JB@adsl-63-202-178-219.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 11:54:28 hi cleverdra 12:05:18 * geakazoid is gone, autoaway/10m (l!on) 12:08:33 geakazoid is here again 12:09:11 --- quit: edrx ([x]chat) 12:18:22 does anyone know of any doanloadable FORTH executables that just run? 12:18:27 --- join: robby (thierry@AReims-101-1-2-215.abo.wanadoo.fr) joined #forth 12:34:10 robby are you a forth programmer? 12:46:05 --- nick: castAdu_w -> adu 12:52:02 i used to but now, I don't often program 12:52:34 why not? 12:52:48 I made my own forth on a z80 machine (TRS80) 12:53:52 after, I tried pascal, but I couldn't make all I wanted with 12:54:29 I thing I'll make a new one for a microcontroller 12:54:47 z80? 12:54:59 anyone know howto get a z80 machine? 12:55:01 you don't know it 12:55:01 robby oh I learned BASIC on the TR*S**) 12:55:23 it's was sympathic 12:55:32 tr*s*? 12:55:36 adu Radio Shack used to give them away at the end of the 1980s 12:55:42 lol 12:56:06 I learned BASIC on this machine too 12:56:17 why would you want to learn BASIC 12:56:24 adu I knew this retired man who was a NASA contract engineer who used his TRS80 until he had a brain hemmorage 12:56:47 what is a trs*? 12:56:48 en 1980, this machine was great and cheap 12:56:50 adu That was in 1980s when I wanted to learn programming and could never afford a PC 12:57:37 i just like learning about everything 12:57:43 not just programming 12:57:50 adu normal people who were not computer engineers only had two choices TRS80 or Commodore unless you wanted a HeathKIt to build your own 12:58:12 adu yes, but I am only talking about programming 12:58:16 soooo many ppl i know on opn started on a c64 12:58:20 commodore, and their peeks and pokes 12:58:43 adu I wanted to understand the Logic of Programming 12:58:49 o 12:59:01 whats there to understand about logic? 12:59:14 adu if you understand Logic it does not matter what you learn Japanese, Chinese of BASIC 12:59:15 basic is not a good language to learn the good way of programming 12:59:16 the only thing you need to know is how the language your writing in works 12:59:27 robby well it was cheap 12:59:34 yes ! 12:59:53 real programmers code it in the client 13:00:15 adu do you mean real coders? 13:00:23 hehehe i dont' know, thats a quote 13:00:37 but "real programmers" don't need languages 13:00:45 they don't even need hexeditors 13:01:20 adu you are in a forth channel, check out the videos online at http://www.ultratechnology.com/ 13:01:21 they just need a machine, and the right tools 13:01:35 adu they need to understand hex 13:02:21 adu we have problems with legacy code irregardless if we passed the Y2K and no one blew up, that we heard about 13:02:34 why? 13:03:00 adu well if you do some checking on the forth web sites, you would find out that the Space Observatories use forth 13:03:13 ya 13:03:17 adu and that there are scientists who have done programming for Space Shuttle Flight 13:03:17 so? 13:03:33 forth is an excelent language for those purposes 13:04:10 "real programmers" are very rare, and usually don't work for companies anymore 13:04:11 you know the old 'jupiter ace' 13:04:28 if they do its to bootstrap a new chip or something 13:04:43 adu well if you wrote a Space Shuttle Mission Critical program with lagacy code, you could have some bugs that were not originally fixed. At the hex level you can program right to the mathematical/technical acuracy which gives you more control over what is going on in Mission Critical programs 13:05:04 yes 13:05:05 adu you might be right about the real programmers, the ones I know are retired 13:05:15 geakazoid: why are you telling me this? 13:05:25 adu because you asked 13:05:33 i say "real" bcuz thats the jargon definition of a "Real programmer" 13:05:43 what did i ask about? 13:06:46 the hexlevel and asm level are roughly equivilent 13:07:13 adu and what is your point? 13:07:32 my point is that "real programmers" are cool, but not useful 13:07:42 adu lol 13:08:15 to "real programmers" Assembly is a HLL 13:09:08 adu a friend of mine had a great grandmother who lived during the Russian Revolution. Her GG-mother told her that after the Technical people were killed there was no one to run the cities and therefore people suffered because they did not know how to run the technology that fed them 13:09:28 adu that could happen again if the real programmers become obsolete 13:10:12 : salut ." bye, everybody" ; salut 13:10:45 i suppose 13:11:12 i only want to be a real programmer 13:11:15 --- part: robby left #forth 13:11:18 not a hacker or cracker 13:11:23 a cracker would be nice tho 13:11:42 i think i'm a hacker already tho 13:12:55 adu real programmers were hackers because they invented programming 13:14:13 i suppose 13:15:05 adu what have you programming lately? 13:15:17 lots, but nothing that works 13:15:23 i've been designing a new language 13:15:34 a very intensionally bloated language 13:15:50 and i'm making an interpreter for it 13:16:01 adu what language? 13:16:15 but i ran into some trouble so i branched, and am doing another interpreter for funge-98 bcuz thats an easy language 13:16:24 you only need to run characters 13:16:27 in perl 13:16:40 i could do it in C, but it would proly take longer 13:17:20 adu why are you hanging out in the forth channel? 13:17:45 my best languages are C/ObjC, Forth, HTML, Lisp, and Perl 13:17:51 bcuz i like forth 13:18:00 and my new lang is based on forth 13:18:29 its actually an odd mixture of forth compiler/lisp reader concepts 13:19:13 adu hrm... 13:20:06 hm? 13:20:53 wouldn't it be cool if ANSI was ANDSO instead? 13:20:59 ANDSO forth would be awsome 13:23:45 adu I dunno know about that... it seems like the forth community needs to collaborate a bit with each other to solidify the intentions of the programs that would be a benefit to everyone invloved 14:43:16 --- quit: I440r (farmer.openprojects.net zelazny.openprojects.net) 14:43:16 --- quit: nate37 (farmer.openprojects.net zelazny.openprojects.net) 14:43:18 --- quit: geakazoid (farmer.openprojects.net zelazny.openprojects.net) 14:43:18 --- quit: adu (farmer.openprojects.net zelazny.openprojects.net) 14:44:00 --- join: I440r (mark4@purplecoder.com) joined #forth 14:44:00 --- join: nate37 (nate@cx83983-d.irvn1.occa.home.com) joined #forth 14:44:00 --- join: adu (andrew@adsl-63-201-90-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 14:44:00 --- join: geakazoid (JB@adsl-63-202-178-219.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 14:50:03 --- quit: Trey (Bowser[1.1-release]: server window terminating...) 14:53:28 --- join: Trey (bowser@ns.TreySoft.com) joined #forth 14:59:10 --- quit: adu (Ping timeout for adu[adsl-63-201-90-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net]) 15:04:33 hello world 15:27:24 --- join: I440r_ (mark4@purplecoder.com) joined #forth 15:27:25 --- quit: I440r (Read error to I440r[purplecoder.com]: Connection reset by peer) 15:54:48 --- join: ree (user@cx1213936-c.phnx1.az.home.com) joined #forth 16:17:57 hello world 16:19:24 heh 16:19:34 gotten that far eh? 17:05:58 hello 17:06:14 hey 17:06:50 are you a forth programmer? 17:08:22 not exactly, more into asm 17:08:33 you? 17:10:48 --- join: adu (andrew@adsl-63-201-90-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 17:11:43 ree an associate tuned me into FORTH, I am just learning my self 17:12:27 into? 17:12:36 thats pretty cool 17:12:48 =) 17:12:54 i think i got it 17:13:09 cells are typed, data is not 17:13:15 yey this is going to be cool 17:13:30 that's cool geak 17:13:48 do you like it so far? 17:14:41 ree well, I gues it is cool, but by this time I really want to get some projects underway: I have spent many years web programming and learning but I wanted a language that would grow 17:15:29 ree well it is exiting that I could actually grow my own so to speak... I have been doing some easy examples, tried out win32forth, bigforth, pygmy forth, end enth 17:15:45 and enth 17:16:50 yeah 17:16:56 I've been doing asm for a few years 17:17:17 I like it because it offers all of the control necessary for what I want to use it for 17:17:52 ree and what do you use it for? 17:18:31 ai/data mining 17:19:30 ree that is similar to some ideas I have except that I want to program a VR teaching program\ 17:20:26 cool 17:21:22 ree the guy who tuned me into the forth is a retired programmer from Lockheed; I was telling him what I wanted to do and he suggested forth 17:21:34 yeah, I am starting a development network based on smc for research in all fields 17:21:37 adu are you there? 17:21:56 ree for commercial or open project style? 17:22:01 no i'm not 17:22:09 adu lol 17:22:11 open project 17:22:14 organization 17:22:22 ree great then we can talk... 17:22:50 heh 17:23:03 u need me? 17:23:03 cool =) 17:23:14 adu no was just wondering 17:23:45 o ok 17:23:51 ree how long have you been programming (sometimes I am talking to teenagers -) ) 17:23:59 i think i figured out a way for all the data and types to work 17:24:09 but now i just need a common top-level structure 17:24:17 6 years 17:24:20 off and on 17:24:52 yeah, I am 20 17:25:07 ree oic... still young 17:25:13 in 3rd grade i was homeschooled and used the computer alot, and learned QBasic 17:25:19 i think thats when i started programming 17:25:29 ree but I would have done the same things I do now when I was 20 if I had a better pc 17:26:05 hehe adu, yeah, I started learning computers when my sister won her computer in high school 17:26:06 adu lucky you... when I was in third grade I had not heard of a calculator 17:26:10 in 6th grade i took along a PC-2 RadioShack programmable calculator, and made a game 17:26:23 called "The Adventures of EyeBall Man" 17:26:25 she's 6 years older than I am 17:26:41 hah adu 17:26:46 I was more interested in hardware at first 17:26:50 then operating systems 17:26:54 then programming =) 17:27:00 it was cute, this little circle with a dot in the middle came on, and this asterix with legs, was the bad guy 17:27:02 adu -) 17:27:28 and u used the arrow keys to move, but there were no bullets or anything, it was very simple 17:27:55 so what are you working on geak? 17:28:00 the faster you pressed the "left" key the more likely you were to win 17:28:04 ree I had visions of hooking my mind up to a pc and it reading my mind and me being able to create things with it when I first saw the Radio Shack TRS80 17:28:25 adu how old are you again? 17:28:37 19 17:28:43 adu oic 17:28:48 is that bad? 17:29:00 adu not if isn't a problem for you 17:29:06 i've turned into a wannabe programmer tho 17:29:16 i haven't made anything at all lately 17:29:22 adu well, programmers rule the world 17:29:31 mosstly bcuz C sucks... and i'm getting lazier 17:29:49 hehe adu 17:29:52 ree so do you have any projects on the net? a web page? 17:29:55 less creative.... you know 17:30:09 well, I have two sites I will be getting started on 17:30:12 dist.net/dist.org 17:30:16 adu a lazy 19 yo, well, that is bad news 17:30:27 why? 17:30:30 the organization name is Development In Science & Technology 17:30:51 ree: how many members do you have NOW? 17:31:50 ree I am not getting it on my browser, it is a www.dist.org or net? 17:33:41 grr win 98 install take 2 hours 17:33:45 hurry up install 17:33:57 geak, not up right now 17:34:06 adu, 4 now 17:34:34 a engineer 17:34:42 another asm programmer 17:34:48 a designer (perhaps) 17:34:49 nice 17:34:57 and this guy right here <-- 17:35:14 so what does "This guy" do? 17:35:16 =) 17:35:22 hehe 17:35:32 basically get exhausted real easily right now =) 17:35:46 geak, I am going to be launching the dist network soon 17:35:57 but I need to design it and get it layed out 17:36:00 so people can join 17:36:07 yupyup 17:36:15 instead of sending hate mail =) 17:36:18 ree what are you going to use for the coding? 17:36:27 well, anything anyone wants 17:36:28 should use php 17:36:38 ree html/xhtml/dhtml/etc 17:36:41 ohh 17:36:43 i'll help with the ws if needed 17:36:46 html 17:36:54 ree good choice 17:37:01 ree it is easy 17:37:21 ree what are the members signing up for? what are the services offered? 17:37:31 yeah, any help is great 17:37:41 well, actually 17:37:52 the main thing is to first get the ai up and going 17:38:00 it isn't real ai, but mainly self modifying code (SMC) 17:38:13 along with a massive database of intelligence 17:38:33 the system will have to be able to take a documented software system and disassemble and reassemble it in its own image 17:38:47 so that people can create their own projects in however they want 17:38:57 but it can still disassemble the information and research they acquire 17:39:02 and process it on its own 17:39:10 so the network behind this will be self evolving 17:39:54 --- quit: ree (brb, one sec) 17:40:04 ree and what will you be writing that in? ASM? 17:40:25 --- join: ree (user@cx1213936-c.phnx1.az.home.com) joined #forth 17:45:47 hey ? 17:46:00 heh, someone I know was playing around with my account 17:46:38 ree are you sure you did not have a rampant ai robot roaming around there? 17:49:27 haha, no, just grem from #osdev 17:49:55 I had no security on this router 17:50:02 so he played with it 17:51:03 ree adu I am going to the SVFIG next this Sat http://www.forth.org/svfig/next.html 17:51:43 geak, would you ever be interested in asm programming? 17:52:11 ree yes, but it seems that I am going all over the map with my learning process 17:53:28 ree are you going to teach me? 17:53:41 hehe 17:53:58 it's actually one of the simplest languages syntax wise 17:54:38 what do you like to do? 17:54:53 I have a friend that does a lot of graphics programming 17:55:05 we were putting together a multiple dimensionality 'world' 17:55:15 that was unified with the underlying structure 17:55:39 ree www.dolfina.org see my web page! 18:17:44 --- join: edrx (edrx@200.240.18.90) joined #forth 19:29:30 --- quit: geakazoid (Leaving... <k!15b8>) 19:49:38 --- quit: adu (Read error to adu[adsl-63-201-90-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net]: EOF from client) 20:04:57 --- join: adu (andrew@adsl-63-201-90-60.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) joined #forth 20:56:33 --- quit: edrx ([x]chat) 21:08:37 * Trey is idle: sleeping 21:27:33 --- quit: nate37 (Ping timeout for nate37[cx83983-d.irvn1.occa.home.com]) 21:32:44 --- join: I440r (mark4@purplecoder.com) joined #forth 21:33:47 --- quit: I440r_ (Read error to I440r_[purplecoder.com]: Connection reset by peer) 21:34:18 --- quit: adu (IRCStep) 22:14:03 --- quit: ree (Ping timeout for ree[cx1213936-c.phnx1.az.home.com]) 23:59:59 --- log: ended forth/01.07.25